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Behind The Scenes Of 'The Long Return'

Published on Mon, 27 Jul 2020 10:00:14 +0000

How an epic tale of fifty years, two men, and one watch came together.

Synopsis

This episode of Hodinkee Radio provides an in-depth behind-the-scenes look at "The Long Return," a two-part documentary feature produced by Hodinkee over more than two years. Host Stephen Polverant sits down with the production team—Will Holloway (head of video and executive producer), Gray Corhonen (producer and director of photography), Dave O'Harrow (video producer and editor), and James Stacy (on-camera host and writer)—to discuss the making of this remarkable story.

The Long Return chronicles the extraordinary tale of two Vietnam War veterans: Marine Lieutenant Barry Jones and Navy Corpsman Laurie McLaughlin. In August 1968, during a fierce battle, Barry was shot multiple times, with one bullet striking his Tudor Submariner watch. Laurie saved Barry's life and evacuated him from the field, and as Barry was being taken away, he left his destroyed watch with Laurie. The two men didn't see each other for fifty years, during which time Laurie kept the battle-damaged watch exactly as it was—complete with bloodstains and bullet damage—in a drawer.

The production team discusses the challenges and emotional weight of documenting this story, from gaining the trust of two private individuals who "had nothing to prove" to filming the unprecedented restoration of the watch at Tudor/Rolex headquarters in Geneva. Part two of the documentary captured the moment when the fully restored watch was returned to Barry, with Laurie present, creating a powerful reversal of the moment that set the story in motion five decades earlier. The team reflects on the difficulty of condensing hours of interviews and footage into a coherent narrative, the technical challenges of shooting in cramped hotel rooms and secure facilities, and the responsibility they felt to honor the story without "screwing it up."

Throughout the conversation, the team emphasizes that this project represents journalism at its finest—a human interest story that transcends the watch community and speaks to themes of friendship, memory, sacrifice, and connection. They express pride in creating something that required empathy, attention to detail, and respect for the profound human experience at its core, while acknowledging that stories like this are exceptionally rare and may be difficult to top.

Transcript

Speaker
Stephen Polverant (Host) / Will Holloway / James Stacy / Dave O'Harrow / Gray Corhonen If we were a movie studio and somebody sent us the script, we would probably reject it, you know, for just being unbelievable, right? Like it's just doesn't these stories do not come along. And our job as storytellers, as visual storytellers, is just not to screw it up. That's our job. To do it justice. And uh, you know, in the end, I think we do. Hey everybody, I'm your host Stephen Polverant and this is Hodinky Radio. We've got a super special episode for you this week and one that I'm really, really excited to share. We're gonna spend the entirety of this week's episode taking a deep dive into the Long Return, which is a two-part video feature that we've produced over the last two plus years. The Long Return tells the story of two men who met at the height of the Vietnam War and the battle damaged Tudor Submariner that kept them connected for over 50 years. It's the story of what happened to that watch, what happened to these two men, and how the watch eventually, five decades later, found its way home and started ticking again. So the two-part video feature is almost 24 minutes in total, but there's so much more than what you see in this final product. So I wanted to get the people who made the long return on the show to kind of give us a peek behind the scenes and they did not disappoint one bit. We sit down with Will Holloway, who's our head of video and was the executive producer on this, Gray Corhonen, who you probably know is the producer of this show, but he was also the producer and director of photography for The Long Return. Dave O'Harrow, who's one of our video producers and led the editing on this. And then we've got James Stacy, who was the on-camera host and the author and editor of this story. Whether you're a watch nerd or whether you're somebody here purely for the human interest, I think there is more than enough to enjoy here. So without further ado, let's do this. Stevie, what's your intro here? Just saying saying hi. What else? I want to get a feel. I want to get a feel. I want to get a I want to get a feel. We'll see you in a couple seconds. We're doing it live, man. Doing it live. Alright. Hey guys, what's going on? Hey, what's going on? Hey. Hi, Stevie. got We we got a hell of a crew in this uh zoom call here. Uh yeah, we do. We do. All-star all-star group here. Uh I I guess we're recording. I guess what the that's what that means is that we're recording. This is what happens when you get three like video professionals in front of the camera. Yeah, exactly. Uh so we got just so everybody knows uh who we got here, we got uh Greg Corhenon who, uh many of you know is the producer of the show. Uh I'm just working my way around my uh my little gallery view here. We've got uh James Stacey, who is a frequent guest on this show and the host of TGN, amongst other things. We've got Mr. Dave O'Harrow, who is a video producer and editor extraordinaire. What's up? And then we've got Mr. Will Holloway who's been leading the Hodinki video efforts since what, like 2012? We don't have to put a number on it. Um for sure. But uh but hello podcast people. Yeah. Specificity is the soul of narrative. Just not Will's narrative. Yeah. This is what happens. We've got writers and we've got video producers on the same call. This is this is gonna be a mess. But uh we'll get it in post. Yeah, exactly. Gray will we'll put it in the show notes, right? The whole thing. No doubt. Look, I always tell the guys it it always works in the end. Okay? So no matter what you say here, it always works. Yeah, because of VFX. Exactly. Perfect. Uh well we're actually here to discuss what what I personally think is like a a crowning achievement of uh of our video department, uh, which is the long return, the two-part uh story about Barry Jones and his incredible Tudor Samariner and how 50 years after uh it left his wrist it found its way back. I'm not gonna tell too much of the story off the bat. I think we'll we'll leave that to you guys, but uh let's let's maybe give people a quick refresher before we get into some of the nitty-gritty and some of the behind the scenes stuff. So James, maybe do you want to start us off by giving us a quick summary of what happened back in the nineteen sixties uh and what led us to to this story? Absolutely. So uh the qu a quick resummary for people who maybe you know it's been a while since you you read through the first post or saw the first video, or maybe this is your first time actually hearing about it, at which point maybe press pause and go back and watch the videos. Um but regardless, uh 1968, it's August. We have two major players, the first lieutenant in the Marine Corps, Barry Jones, and the third hospital corpsman, Laurie McLaughlin. And uh we have Barry's Tudor Submariner, which is a reference 79-28, for those wondering, and uh they end up in a uh pretty gnarly uh battle. Uh they weren't um necessarily part of each other's kind of overall flow in Vietnam, but they ended up in in a large offensive and uh and in that process uh Barry was shot several times and and one of the bullets actually uh went through his wrist and hit the watch and essentially destroyed it or came as close as you could come to destroying a watch uh like that. Uh In the process, uh Lori, Mr. McLaughlin, uh doing what he did got Barry off the field, and as he was taking uh to Medevac, uh the watch was just kind of hanging off of his, you know, very much injured wrist, uh, and he left uh the watch to Laurie. The two men then didn't see each other for fifty years. The war continued in in some metric for both of them. Obviously uh Barry came home to the States and had to go through a lot of uh you know rehabilitation and then both men kind of moved on to prosperous post-war lives and existences and families and jobs and the rest of it. And then 50 years later, uh, it turns out that uh uh Lori was able to get in touch with uh Barry's son uh and put the wheels in motion for them to meet up and and part of that included him returning this badly beaten Tudor submariner, the exact condition that it was in when uh Barry had given it to Laurie. Lori was able to give it back to Barry almost exactly fifty years later. That's a truly wild, wild story. And I I I wonder, Will, you're the one who kind of found this for us and and shepherded it through production into what became the long return, parts parts one and two. Um can you tell us a little bit about like how this landed on your radar and then how we kind of connected with these two guys to to make this story happen? Yeah sure. Um you know, we were very lucky and fortunate to um to sort of come across the story. Um as it happened, after having the watch for a while, Barry inquired with his local jeweler in Portland, Oregon about the possibility of restoring the watch. Um his you know idea was to get it back in in working order and and that he would give it to his son uh at some point, you know, you know, down the line. Yeah. Um it the watch made its way eventually to Geneva to to Tutor Rolex uh HQ. And um I think it was late October of 2018, I got a call from uh Christophe Chevalier, who um you know became a character in this story in in part two. And he said, he said, hey, Well, I've got this great story. Um, perhaps you guys are interested in in covering it. Uh I looked at the basic details and was immediately you know blown away by this by this story. He put me in touch with with Mr. Jones. You know, Barry and I had a few conversations. I got to know him a little bit. Um and uh started to learn about Laurie a little bit, uh, so the characters kind of you know, kind of became clear. Um and then, you know, it sort of took some time, some back and forth. Um, you know, these two guys aren't exactly, you know, media trained TV types. These are pretty, you know, these guys are living quiet, quiet lives out there. Uh but then they agreed in uh early 2019, uh they were having a reunion of their platoon in St. Louis, um, and they agreed to tell the story of um of the watch on camera to us. And you know, the four of us were were there to, you know, to hear that. And so that would that became the you know the long return part one. Cool. And then, you know, we we produced this video and then how did part two happen? Because I know when we when we set out to produce part one, there was no there was no idea of it being part one and part two. Like we we thought we were telling the story and then the story became more interesting than You know, after having the watch, like I said, Barry um was looking to have it have it repaired. It was in Geneva. It for a long time they w they were kind of taking a look at it and trying to figure out a game plan for you know you know for doing that. At some point, you know, I was in touch with with Christoph there at at Tutor and and he said, you know, we're gonna do it. Uh we're we're gonna try to to fix it. We don't know what's gonna happen, but um you guys can can come and film it. And and this was sort of unprecedented access to the to the workshop there to you know to film. So you know we went through that process um and the watch was repaired, as people have seen in you know, in part two. And then it was returned earlier this year to Barry, um, with Lori at his side in a place called Hood River, Oregon. Um, so the narratives there kind of converged, and um, you know, we were there to document that that part of the story. Yeah, that's it's it's pretty incredible. I mean, I remember when, you know, I think we were just like having either a basic editorial meeting or maybe you and I were just like chatting over a coffee and I remember you very casually mentioning that this story existed and I was like, wait, wait, what? Like, excuse me, what's what's happening? I think as as journalists like these are the kinds of stories that like really get us salivating. Like they're they're about watches, but like only kind of. Like they're really about it's about people and it's about history and it's about culture and it's about the ways in which like watches can can play a part in that. And I wonder, you know, I'll open this up to to everybody, like, do you guys remember your your reactions when you first heard about this story? Like before we started getting involved ourselves. Yeah, and in my mind, I remember um hearing about the story long before anyone was assigned to it, or just just I think Will mentioning it in passing. And uh Will maybe can correct me if he remembers the conversation, but I think I said like where is this coming from? 'Cause I feel like you read anecdotal three sentence stories like this pretty commonly, and then you can't you can't source them, you can't get everybody aligned. Like like even even up until you know even a month before we produced the the first video, there's a chance it just wasn't going to happen. I mean these are like Will said, kind of like private people with whole lives that don't have anything to do with the publicity of this watch or or of their their history as uh you know as as as men who served in the Vietnam War. Uh they've you know they have there's it's a multifaceted sort of thing. So I think every time you hear these or you say, like, oh well, you know, this interesting group of the military use this watch, it would be so fun. There's always there, there's always that statement. It would be so interesting, it would be so fun, it would be so special to be able to capture that. And I think I I think I led into this with just general skepticism, which is j kind of my speed with a lot of stuff. It's a pretty good instinct for a journalist, right? Like skep skepticism is a healthy thing when you're when you're doing this, not not a bad thing, I think. Yeah, and I think in many ways for me the the skepticism isn't even necessarily like um uh one of journalistic integrity or something like that. It's just more like I I have enough understanding, and you know, at least well, actually, all four of you know that I have enough understanding to know when something is gonna be hard, but not enough intelligence to actually decide to not do it, uh, typically. Um, and uh, and I think in this case, luckily I had we had a big team, I I had a very small role in both parts of the film. Uh uh but uh you know it I I think what's remarkable about this is that all of the moving parts, I mean think about these are the whole world, Tudor, Rolex, two guys that hadn't seen each other for 50 years, and us kind of on an ancillary edge of this were able to dip in as things connected in front of us. I think that's the r the the most remarkable part of it. Yeah, you know, I was thinking about it this morning. You know, if we were a movie studio and somebody sent us this script, we would probably reject it, you know, for just being unbelievable. Right? Like it just doesn't these stories do not come along. Right. This is just an an amazing story. And our job as storytellers, as visual storytellers, is just not to screw it up, right? I mean that's what that's our job, to do it justice. And uh you know in the end I think we did. Yeah, I I would agree. And I mean that that that gets us to something I wanted to ask you about, Will, is like heading into this. You you really quarterback this whole thing and like how how did you start to strategize and figure out how we were going to be a part of this and how we were gonna tell this story without screwing it up and and like doing it justice and without kind of like you know there there are so many ways to get like the tone wrong or the feel wrong or to make somebody feel weird and then it falls apart like how how did you really kind of build a game plan for how to how to do this? Yeah the first thing was was gaining the trust of the participants and and that's you know a big thing in in any story. Like I said, these guys weren't exactly clamoring to jump on camera and and and tell their story. Um so y you know, up to the time that we went to St. Louis, you know, I was a little skeptical of of of whether or not this was gonna work out. We got there, we had dinner with them, we had a nice dinner with them, and we, you know, we kind of got to know each other a little bit and after like half an hour or 45 minutes i remember thinking okay you know this is gonna work out these guys are comfortable with us they they they understand what we're trying to do here and I think we're in pretty good shape. The one thing I would highlight about one about meeting them and those guys, especially at that dinner, is um because I I don't know that this is something that I would have appreciated until I had the ability to take part in in a project like this, is these I've never met two guys that had less to prove. Yeah. So the in the inverse of that's a funny thing to say and it's I think it's very true, but consider and and I would say not only for the us and Hodinki and and the favor they did all of us and allowing us to be part of this. But to everyone who watched it and enjoyed it, imagine they have so little to prove they didn't have to do this. So their their willingness to play along with cameras and mics and stuff that like, I do this for a living, and I don't like having a mic clipped onto me. I don't like sitting in front of a camera and trying to remember a script or a story or whatever. So imagine just being like a guy, right? They they had nothing to prove and and instead, instead of coming at it from like uh why wh wouldy would I I do this? Why would I tell this story? I don't understand, I I don't want to be part of it, it was just pure generosity. They took their time, they out of their schedule, they took their their effort. I mean they traveled some distance to do the the stuff in St. Louis that we did. And that I think that's what I that what what really like still sticks out for me in meeting them originally was I thought like maybe there'd be some bravado, some kind of like you know tough guy military sort of vibe, and it was none of that. They had zero to prove. They answered every question you could possibly have in the most forthright and calm and gentle manner. And and I think that I don't I genuinely at some time I was kinda I remember being at the dinner and be like, I don't really know why they want to do this, but I'm d I'm really glad they're they're they're they're they're like this, that they're they're so sweet and kind with their time. Yeah, I mean could you blame them for being a little bit skeptical of four guys showing up from New York with you know tons of cameras and equipment from a watch website. You know, you haven't seen your buddy in 50 years. You've just returned the watch to them, and these these Yahoos show up and and w youanna know, kinda record you uh and and tell your story. Uh Yahoo's Yahoo's is a pretty good summary of the uh group of guys we got on this call. This is this is the Yahoo Brigade. Yeah let's let's get that in edit. Okay. These uh these professionals. If if I could add too, there's there's probably a reciprocity there too. Like I mean the real stars of of this project are are very at Lori and they're not here to speak for themselves, but I'm sure there's a little bit of measuring going on on their part too when they first meet us, you know, because we're literally bunch of guys flying into a random city to make this project and we only have so many hours um within you know those those couple of days to to make it happen so every little moment we've spent with those guys I personally was absorbing just to get a sense of who they are and and in the long run it of it affects the the end product too of of how you tell their story. So one thing that I remember just from meeting Barry is just and Laureate um it's just like the the kind of like the glint in their eyes. You could tell there's like a there's a lot of wisdom there. He's uh grandfather. I I remember him being like like ripped still. Right. So automatically without him knowing he he's a strong figure for for to lead this project. So yeah, that was my my initial impressions. As much as they were striking, we handle a lot of watches, modern and vintage. We've seen things that have been put through the ringer. Nothing with blood dried on the dial. What what what's what's everyone's reaction when you see that watch for the first time? Yeah, I mean, like you say, we've handled a lot of watches. Um and this was one that was you know actually not working in its in its present state at that time. But in a weird sense, none of the watches that we've handled felt so alive as this one. You know, this thing was like it felt like a living, breathing object. You know, and it was it was a little bit surreal. And like you say, the the blood was sort of caked on the on the case and and part of the strap. Um so it it was pretty intense. the metal on the case was curved. It's almost like dolly-like. Uh I don't know what the painting is like the the persistence of memory or something, the melting clocks. And not just for the surreal aspect of it, but just the way that the metal was was curved, you you get a sense of the impact that he took from the bullet, you know, and it's it's very haunting, you know. Yeah, I mean uh from my from my standpoint, I you know the the easiest way for me to explain it sounds a little bit grandiose in that like I think it's one of the most immense objects I've ever experienced. Like it it's experiencing something that that that was um that had like transcended whatever it had originally designed to be and it had become something I don't know more or special or significant in and of its own. But holding it almost encapsulated everything that I find interesting with watches. Like like a watch is a watch is a great thing, but like ninety nine point nine repeating is just product that that will be worn purchased by someone and worn until the battery dies or until it needs a repair and then it's thrown away. And the fact that this watch had a huge life, it went to war, it was a true tool watch, it was born in like the golden era of Swiss tool watches and then to to sit in a drawer uh not so much ignored or forgotten, but just not needed for 50 years, and then to come back and now be given this entirely secondary life, which we were happy, you know, thrilled even to be able to cover. But the fact that it went through these stages, I just think like it in it encapsulates everything that is watch enthusiasm. Enthusiasm in a product that could be forgotten. I just wanted to to jump in there. I think it's easy to say 50 years and you know kind of gloss over it. That is such a long time. You know, that you know, uh half a century, you know, that's two gray lifetimes right there. You know, two grays. More accomplished for sure um but the you know the fact that this thing was was sitting there in this drawer um you know for that long and just sort of like holding its its story inside I just sort of had the sense I mean Stephen Stephen has held the watch that was on the top of Everest. Yeah. And and I've sat I've stood next to the case, as many people have, to one of the watches that was on the moon. Those are incredible things to stand, especially if you like you love watches and then to get to experience them, that's that's all next level stuff. I think that this is this is that, but like magnified. Yeah. It's so hu it's such a human thing now. I I totally agree with everything you guys are saying, and I I I really wanna hammer home something that Will touched on, which is like the life that this watch lived initially on on Barry's wrist and when he was he was shot and the impact that this had on the watch and and kind of imbuing that moment into the like physical character of this watch is important and is interesting and is obviously key to this story. But to me, I almost find more interesting the fact that Lori kept it for 50 years and like kept it exactly as it was and like he didn't go get it fixed up and wear it. He didn't get rid of it. He didn't sell it. He didn't whatever. It like the idea that he could keep it for fifty years as as a like totem to this connection he had with another human being. Like I can't even imagine what must have gone through his mind every time he looked at that watch, or like, you know, what happened when he like moved? You know, like what did he do with it to take it from one location to the next? Like to to have such care and reverence for not just an object, but for what that object represents is such a beautiful, powerful thing when you stretch it over fifty years like that. Like anybody can become obsessed with something and love it for six months, a year or whatever, take care of it, whatever, but like to do that for fifty years is a really powerful, profoundly human thing, uh that I just like even just talking about it like I get a chill. Like I find it deeply, deeply moving. And how many times do you suppose he he thought about you know the prospect of returning it to you know you know to Barry and what that process would be like and how that would you know sort of be uh uh uh the entryway into reconnecting with with his with his you know fellow soldiers. Um really just a an an amazing thing. Yeah. Let's let's talk a little bit about some behind the scenes stuff. Uh you know people uh I I hope everyone listening has seen the two halves of this film. If you haven't, again, please pause this and just go watch these two films. They're incredible. And also, all of this will make a lot more sense if you've seen the long return parts one and two. But um, you know, can you guys give us a little taste of of behind the scenes here? Like what was it like setting up production for this? What was it like being there with these guys? You know, it's hours and hours and hours with these people. So can can you give us some insight into that? So from our perspective you know on the on the video squad you know part one was certainly the simpler story to tell um and so our job was to go you know land in St. Louis and uh nail an interview, nail the B-roll, you know, don't forget anything, back up everything and get home and then work on that story. You know, um we are our set there was a cramped hotel room at I forget the name of the hotel, but um I believe it was the best western okay, maybe best western at the airport in in St. Louis. Um decent Mexican food nearby. Pretty good Mexican food nearby. Yeah. Yeah. We eat a lot of Mexican food. Yeah, for sure. Um, you know, just out of frame there from what you saw on on film, you had a a bed with a couch on top of it, with a desk on top of that, with a T V somehow in in there. It was it was all pretty cramped. But you know that sort of gets into into the process of of storytelling like this and and production. You can plan all you want, but it's a process of troubleshooting, you know, kind of on the fly and making and making good decisions about that process. Um, you know, uh Gray as sort of our DP on the ground, I'll I'll let you talk about the setup there and how that and how that kind of came together. Fairly straightforward, honestly. You know, like you said, our job was to to get there and and not screw it up. We had really compelling characters. We had, you know, this object that ties it all together. In terms of what we actually captured on the ground, like you said, it's an interview with our subjects in suboptimal conditions, i.e. a queen double bed uh room at the best western in St. Louis, and then a bunch of footage of the watch itself. And here's here's where like we gotta shine some serious spotlight on Mr. Dave O'Hara because in the end, it's an interview and footage of the object itself. And that's what we went back to New York with. And that's what Dave had to start cutting with. And if you watch the long return part one, the assets captured in St. Louis are a fraction of what your experience is in that film. Everything else is Dave pulling assets together, whether it's archival images and video, whether it's his creative way of treating some uh photo assets he had, the the real magic comes together in the editing room. And so major props to Mr. Dave O'Hara on that one. Absolutely. Thanks, Gray. I was just about to shine the light on you and then you turned it on me. We got we got lights going every which direction here right now. Well just to touch on what Gray was saying and what how Will alluded to him, like going back to how we shoot this, it's like you know uh I I I give Gray a lot of props for seeing how we frame these shots because we're not working with much. Like you pan the camera eight inches to the right and you'll see Will sitting there on the queen size bit, you know in terms of like how the magic is is sprinkled on that honestly it it it the spine is is Barry's storytelling you take the most compelling things he says yeah you start there and all the archival footage stuff like I learned something new through that process of of just kind of go combing through the internet for for historical footage um that was genuine and that was true to that time period. So yeah, it all kind of came together. Yeah, one of the things that that is an important part, I think, of the reporting process and and the editing process is, you know, you're your your raw materials are somebody else's story and them telling that story, but you're then making tons of decisions about what to include, what order to put it in, how to piece it together and how to sort of like translate it to someone, you know, like you said you had over an hour of interview footage and you have to then condense that into 13 minutes and somehow still try to like tell that whole hour of story or at least do that whole hour justice. And and I wonder, did you did you find it uh maybe stressful is not the right word, but like did you feel a certain burden to like do this justice and like do it right and like not somehow mess up this this story in the same ways that Will Will has been talking about? I I wouldn't call it stressful. In the process, there's there's those stressful moments and normally it's like right in the beginning because I would liken it almost to like making a sculpture. Like here you are, here's a big piece of clay, you don't know what it is, it's it's very nebulous and formless and and now you're trying to shape it in a way that's uh makes sense and is beautiful. But um for me as long as you know kind of the beginning, the middle and the end and where you want to to end up, then then you'll eventually get there. And and um what's important is that the the story itself had so much heart and so that telling of it wasn't stressful, I would say it just takes time. Um yeah, because there's no embellishment here. There's no um trying to uh you know p,ull something out of thin air to make it all happen. It's just the the pieces are there. It's just how can you have it unfold in the most genuine way? You know? I mean for me it it's it's you know it's pretty easy. You uh you hire people who are better than you are at certain aspects of uh of uh what you're trying to accomplish so uh you know you know you've got grade uh on the ground uh handling the you know the cinematography and you've got Davy uh back in the office uh handling the edit and you sit back and you kinda watch and it all and then you have James as honestly as the you know on screen talent and as the voice of this thing. And uh and you're good. You know th those are the elements. So you're just like chilling on the queen size bed eating some uh fried ravioli, St. Louis style? Yeah, I think I was I was talking to Laurie's wife for uh for a a good chunk of time. Very pleasant conversation. Uh learned all about their childhood in Iowa. Um you know, easy for me. So all right, so we we talked a little bit about about the behind the scenes from the production standpoint, but with Well one thing that came up a lot in you know comments later was you know wow you know Lori played a big part in this story. Uh he's really the the the linchpin in this whole thing. Um and you know did he he didn't get a watch, you know, or or or whatnot. Uh he did get a watch, in fact. Uh he was gifted a Tudor uh Black Bay 58 uh for his um for his part in the story uh for his you know major part in the story. So that was a nice um that was a nice move on on their part. Yeah, I got that question a lot online and you know, d Rolex being Rolex and the rest of it and everybody's privacy wanting to maintain that, we didn't I wasn't Dope watch. Yeah, and I know that he wears it proudly uh out there in Colorado. So it's it's a it's a nice feel-good, feel-good thing. That's awesome. Let's make sure we get some conversation in here about part two because uh if I remember correctly just from like sort of the ambient conversations in the office, uh production logistics for part two were infinitely more complicated, right? Yeah. Uh you know, indeed. And I I I think part of that was you know the the the major part of that was the actual restoration. So I think maybe we start there and then get into how filming of the return of the watch, you know, it sort of came together. But um the watch was at Tudor Rolex in Geneva, and we got word in the okay that we could be there as they as they restored it and and and that was the crucial part of this story. Um that was the exciting part of this. Could this thing be fixed? Um so I you know it was an honor to be able to be there and to film that. It was kind of a surreal experience. James was there with me for that, along with Samuel, one of our freelance uh video contributors who we w we work with a lot. Um I got locked in a hot car and learned what it's like to be a dog in a parking lot. Yeah I'm sorry. Don't leave your don't leave it. Don't leave your car I do not know that story. We we were in um France, right? Correct. So we had driven to France in Sam's Audi A1. And I was in the backseat, I was crazy tired. I've been doing a lot of traveling and then got the call to pop over to Geneva for uh this and we were doing some drone shooting, you know, kind of like the the general production work that goes before some of the other stuff and Sam said he knew a spot that was kind of like up on a bluff. And we drove up and in the process at uh as I want to do, I fell asleep. I don't know what time zone my brain was actually in. I fell I fell asleep. And I woke up when when they got to the top and they were like, Oh, we're gonna go shoot some stuff, like you're good. And I was like, All right, cool. And I just kinda like rolled back over in this little hatchback and fell asleep and then a few minutes later, uh, it was too hot. Uh you know, it was probably I don't know what was it, eighty five degrees, maybe something like that, in uh in and around that area. Maybe not quite that hot. Fifty five to sixty, I think. Yeah, yeah, yeah. With a balmy thirty four, yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. And and I just remember uh being like, oh wow, it's it's pretty spicy in here. I'm I'm gonna go catch up with them. I could see them just, you know, across the field. And I go to open the doors, nothing. I go to put down the windows, nothing. I like try and see if I can reach the back hatch. Nah, it's not gonna happen. And then I I wait like uh my Canadianism probably let me wait like about twenty minutes until I was like kinda pouring sweat and thinking like I'm not in any actual danger, but this is very uncomfortable. And so I started sending text messages to these two, but we were kind of in a weird, you know, reception area. So I wasn't sure that they' greetting any of them. And uh it was clean that's the point where I get a text from Sarah being like, Hey, do you have Sam's number? And I'm like, yeah, sure, here it is. Like, why do you need it? And she responds back, James is locked in his car. Yeah, so uh you know I was droning. We were getting some beautiful shots of wide shots of Geneva. I kept getting these notifications, text messages from James. I was ignoring them because I was flying a drone. And uh little did I know that he was dying in the back of the car. Don't leave babies, don't leave dogs in your car. Uh you can leave James's in your car. Uh we're powerful enough to handle And this has been a public service announcement brought to you by Hodinky Radio. But I I I I hadn't thought about that since the day it happened and it just popped into my mind while we were doing this. Uh that was that was a neat trip. It was a it was a uh uh uh speak use to use the word again in a different different uh methodology, it was a trip to go inside Rolex. I had no idea what to expect. I wasn't sure if it was kind of like entering a military base where you' greonna be, you know, bio imprinted, laser scanned the rest of it. Uh but it's you know a beautiful building. Well I'm sure Will can speak to this as well. But it's this it's this gorgeous building that we've all seen pictures of from the outside. And you go in, it's of course very quiet, but not as kind of like serious or security-minded as I thought. Uh and not unlike anyone who's ever been to Basel World. It's kind of like passing muster at the Basel World Rolex booth. Uh it was a little bit more, you know, they were expecting us, so we didn't tender uh business cards or anything like that. And and then yeah, we got some we got some ID and we basically just kind of stayed near someone who knew where we were supposed to be, but a really cool building for sure and and a neat place to go into. We were told at one point, I'm not sure uh you know how how this works entirely, but I think we were the furthest like external camera crew. I think we were the furthest an external camera crew has ever gone into Rolex. Certainly that building or maybe that department was the uh the framing. My Swiss French isn't isn't what it used to be. That's what they told us at least. You know, who knows? You know we were tired, you know. So tired. Some of us had been sleeping in the house. Then it was, you know, it was the restoration and that was obviously a special thing to, you know, to observe. It was so cool. It was it it was pretty cool. And you know, it it wasn't in and of itself, you know, having shot watch um watchmakers in factories since the Carter administration apparently. Um it it it wasn't so different from shooting in other places. You know, you go in, you have your cameras, you have your tripods, you have your lights, you look for your angles, you set it up, you you check your batteries, your SD cards, all that kind of stuff. But yeah, but in the back of your mind, you know you have one shot at this, right? You can't miss something. You can't mess. You can't go back on this. So a little bit of you know apprehension there. Um there were a few times I had to double check to make sure I hit you know the record button because I was sort of standing there staring at this thing, you know, in just in in in kind of amazement um and you know the big moment was when the guy when the guy broke out the hammer you know early on in the process and uh you know here we are at probably the most renowned, famed watchmaker in the world, and you know you're expecting the the most cutting edge approach to this restoration. And this guy brings out a hammer. Um We're we're all in white robes. Yeah. Immaculately dressed. Not sweaty 'cause that the air conditioning is lovely, unlike the interior of a Audi A one on the top of a French Hillside. Um but they lead us after that you we've seen the movement kind of disassembled and has gone through the cleaning process. Then they lead us into this other little room. And inside this room is is is just one dude and he's surrounded by kind of like old school tools. But it's not like a barn, obviously it's not like a barn. It's not like any of the the garages that I grew up in. It's this beautiful, you know, sort of like NASA grade space but it's full of these old school tools that are sitting in you know in wood holders that are are very much at like a handcraft sort of thing and to see the two kind of like blended together. It was a a really special thing. And then just to see this guy like grab a big ball peanut hammer and be like, I'm gonna smash it. Alright, dude. It sort of felt like you know you you you were going to the best dentist in the world and for a very delicate procedure and you're sitting there and they sort of bring hammers at you. This guy could have had your wisdom teeth out in oh maybe five seconds. Yeah for sure. And it's just at this point, you know, having you know, worked with the guys and and you know, having known the watch, you you become a little bit protective of it, you know, in a way. Like he's really gonna hit it with a with a hammer. Um but yeah, that's exactly what happen.ed Did you guys all kinda wince the first time uh there was metal on metal contact? J James did. I I didn't I've yeah, I've never winced once in my entire life. Oh okay. Okay. I pr I forgot James. No, no, I I thought I was more just fascinated. Um because I that level of handcraft is is is absolutely required to make a watch what it is. Um even if it's simply building, you know, compute now with let's say CNC and the rest of it builds upon what people used to do with their hands. But to see it done um in this scenario where everybody, not just us, but everybody knew they had one shot. Yeah. This is not this is not the watch to make the hammer, you know, to hit your thumb or or the rest of it. Like it's crazy. And and the absolute sort of joy that the specialists, the restoration specialists had um as he went about this process. I mean he was really in a in a good place, you know, and really enjoying the the the process. But you know, nobody really knew what knew what was gonna happen. You know, there were there were a few moments there where it was like, um the hands. You're gonna break that hand. Like for sure. Uh but uh yeah it it they they they pulled it off. Uh it was quite quite a special thing to see. I remember when Ben visited Rolex years and years ago that when he got back I asked him like what what things surprised him the most and he said how much they still do by hand that like you think of Rolex as this place where like, you know, they're making a about million watches a year. They don't disclose that, but it's it's estimated at about a million watches a year. Um and that they're doing it largely using cutting edge technology. But then you see how much stuff is still done the old way, done by hand. And it sounds like that's that's exactly what the approach was here. And it's it's pretty wild to think about that. It really is. And it was really a you know really an amazing thing to watch, especially as a an important part of the story and kind of knowing what this all meant to you know the folks back in in in the states to to bury um you know and to Laurie um and and to know that that you were there watching it and you knew the outcome kind of before they did, you know, felt you know kind of surreal. Yeah. Um but really kind of a unique thing to to be able to observe. And then of course, you know, the moment that the the hand the repaired hands went back on, everything was you know, reassembled, and you see this thing, you know, you see this thing ticking. Uh that was that was quite special. A rare narrative beat in things that we cover where the stakes are legit, you know? The stakes are high. This is an object that we are now emotionally invested in because we're emotionally invested in the people to whom the object belong. And here's a risky process that can have a huge payoff or a huge emotional And one guy uh I think one one commenter said his his butt cheeks were clenched when uh he was watching the hands being bent. That's an appropriate reaction. Uh yeah, it's great. I mean I I like the idea that you said like you know what's going on here before Barry and Lori. And like I think that really does raise the stakes for you guys because it's not like you're standing there with them. It's like if something went wrong, like presumably you guys wouldn't be the ones who have to tell them, but like somebody would have to call them and be like, uh things didn't go so hot, you know? And like that I can't even dwell on that. Like I'm I'm getting stressed out just thinking about that. Uh I mean it's it's both lucky and a testament to the the skill of the folks at Rolex and Tutor that they were able to to pull this off. It's it's a pretty impressive thing that, you know, I I don't know if you, know, every watchmaker could pull this off, and I don't know if every watchmaker would even care to pull this off. Um so, you know, I I kinda give them props there. But w one of the big differences between part one and part two here is is part one really took place in one location, production took place in one location. Part two, you had this whole this whole drama in Geneva of restoring the watch, but then it had to it had to go back home. Like you you have this whole second uh production location, this whole second set of logistics, this whole second story to tell in Hood River, Oregon, with with Barry and Laurie getting the watch back fully restored. Um can can you tell us a little bit about how that got set up and came together and what it was like to go out there kind of like this this is the kind of climax of this emotional journey that you guys have been on for what like the the better part of a year and a half at this point? Yeah, exactly. Um and you know as I said previously, you know, Gray and Dave and I talked about what we could accomplish on this trip at length, and then we did it again, and then we did it again, and then we did it again. Um so you know, we had a plan, but as I said also previously, you have to kind of think on the fly and and and you'll kind of make it work. But we knew what we wanted to accomplish going out there. We knew that we wanted to get footage of them responding to the first video to bring viewers back to that uh in in in part two. Uh we knew we wanted footage of them watching the restoration, which they had not seen before. So that you know, to get their response to that. We knew that we wanted to follow Christoph from the airport to Hood River to kind of capture that journey and have these two you know timelines kind of converge as the watch as the watch came back. We wanted to capture the reunion. We wanted to get a quick interview with Barry to kind of frame uh everything uh out here. And then we wanted to get a kind of more romanticized shot of these three characters in in the environment. Um and that's that shot that you see at the end um you know by the river um which is kind of a Korhonan special uh I would say you know I I I would say. So we went into it with a plan and you know we made it work. We you know Davy got up and went to the airport um to you know follow Christoph as he you know as he came in. Gray and I kind of set up at the Hood River Hotel in beautiful downtown Hood River. Um and and and made it work. Um Gray, do you want to talk about what that setup was like and and and how that played out? Sure. We're giving it a lot of free pub, man. The best western of uh St. Louis and Hood River uh hotel. I I would hope that we're seeing some some checks. I haven't seen any yet. Well that's uh I have um Um yeah, as as far as the setup, I mean, much like part one, you know, it it you you have one bite at the apple, really. You have one opportunity to capture this moment of the watch now being returned in its fully restored fashion. The game there is to make it somewhat visually compelling looking, but also make sure, like I said, you have the coverage to capture that one moment. You can't recreate the moment where Barry sees his watch for the first time. Like, you know, that that was not staged in any way other than we we put these characters in the same space. That is the first time he sees the watch. That reaction is genuine. You know, going back to what James said, these folks have nothing to prove. They are they are not there for for performance. They are there to uh as they would probably put it, get a job done. Um but uh what what you see unfold in part two is very much, you know, what we were seeing firsthand in in Hood River. And and James and and Stevie and hopefully for all the listen listeners out there, what you're really hearing right now is kind of like how our pre production meetings go. Like a few hours before we're about to shoot, like the night before, it's usually Gray, myself and and Will in the hotel room after probably, you know, eating Chinese food or or some type of burrito. Kind of go through these bullet points and that's how we go into it is with these intentions. But it's really up to the the universe at that point for for Barry and Lori to show up. And I think on this shoot in particular, it helped a lot that we had a rapport with them. We were all witnessing it um as it unfolded, you know. Yeah, that's a good point, Davey. And I it's also, you know, we all come at it with slightly different ideas and perspectives and and I think the magic kind of happens at the intersection of those. You know, we kind of throw it all in a pot and and mix it up and and and see what kind of see what kind of uh entree we we uh you know we we come out with um uh a apparently a burrito of something. Um I gotta say the first time I saw a cut of part two, which was just a few days before uh before we released it, I was completely blown away. And and it's it's a rare thing that I get to experience anything we produce like our audience does. Usually, you know, I've seen cuts along the way. Often like I'm even when other people are shooting weak on the wrists and things like that, like talking watches, I'm in the room, like I'm I'm not watching footage, I'm watching it happen. This was something that I I got to experience truly as an audience member, and it was so impactful and so exciting to get to see this come together. Uh and and some of the creative decisions, like the the decision to watch them watching the footage, uh really just to me like took this to a whole other level. Like it it that layering of the story and you know re-centering the story of the restoration on these people uh to me just totally totally changed changed the feel of this. Yeah, I mean uh bringing in into the editing process like just within them watching the footage, you you what we're really going for is is their reactions to it. And that's kind of that's something that I I kind of like look out for when when I'm pine, you know, going through and combing over all this footage. So So like that to me was was cool too and I think um that was a collective uh creative decision. I I think Gray may have uh brought up that idea and it's just unique ways to tell this story and and it it it shows up in the in the final product, you know? I mean obviously the the sort of emotional climax of this whole thing is is when Barry gets the watch back. And, you know, his his emotional reaction to that is is kind of like the centerpiece of this whole thing. But I I wonder what your emotional reactions were in that that moment. Again, we've we've talked about the fact that like you've all been involved in this story for for well over a year. You know these people now. Like what what did it feel like for you guys to watch that that box open and kind of like see the look on his face. Well obviously it was a it was a big moment, you know, for all of us. Um a as you sort of see or as you've sort of learned about, you know, Barry, he's pretty reserved in his responses to you know to to these things. Um I I you know he's one of those people who's kind of seen it all so nothing is uh that shocking or or that crazy to to to him. Um So clearly it was a it was a great moment. But for me it was less about that singular moment than it was about the entirety of what was going on there. And one thing that I that really touched me there was was the fact that Lori was there number one to be a part of this thing again. Um but it it was you know as he said in the video he said something along the lines of Yeah. It's opened me up to speak about my
Barry Jones / Laurie McLaughlin my months in Vietnam. And I belong to a few veterans groups that I've been able to share. And it's easier to share with veterans that have experienced some part of this, and they're always amazed by the story and
Stephen Polverant (Host) / Will Holloway / James Stacy / Dave O'Harrow / Gray Corhonen the coincidences that all came about in it. This video that we created had enabled him to share this difficult experience with people and and he was able to open up about it and and I think you know it it was you know there was some therapy going on there to to to you know to put it bluntly and it felt really good to know that and to see that in action and to see him again in person to be a part of this. So the watches return to to to Barry, but he is just as much a part of the story as, you know, as Barry is. So I always caught myself out of the corner of my eye, you know, kind of looking at Laurie and seeing seeing his response. Um because to me that was a really special part of this whole project. All right. So so Will, that's your sort of favorite moment of this. I'm I'm curious then for the other three of you guys, what what was kind of the highlight for you personally? And it doesn't have to be what you think is the biggest moment, it can just be the moment that that sorry you took the most away from uh through through this process. Maybe we'll start with Gray. My moment is similar to Will's in that uh it is about the relationship between Barry and Lori and the interplay that they have. And it's it's probably one of the most impactful lines from parts one and two, but it's Barry recounting his first conversations with Lori after they've been reunited, and how one of the first things they talk about is the watch. Got this c
Barry Jones / Laurie McLaughlin all. Does the name Laurie McLaughlin mean anything? And uh I said of cour
Stephen Polverant (Host) / Will Holloway / James Stacy / Dave O'Harrow / Gray Corhonen se I said the watch and in in the piece itself uh Barry's tearing up a little bit with you know the recollection of that conversation, the rec recollection of you know ghosts of fifty years ago, Dave expertly cuts to a the two shot of the two of them, right? As Barry taps Lori on the thigh and Lori kind of like knowingly nods his head and and tears well up in his eyes as well. Um, as you know, kind of a crystallization of everything that this is about, right? It's about the two, these two men and and the object that binds them James, how about for you? Yeah, mine's the same moment. Yeah, I thought it was the you know, I I wasn't able to be there due to shooting schedules and everything else for uh Barry getting the watch back in part two, but uh I sat uh you know a couple feet away from them at attempting to get them to tell this story in in the moment that Gray just describ I can't do a better job than Gray. So uh it was uh it was a thing just to just to get a chance to hear the story in in that sort of a linear fashion, in a fashion where they understood uh, you know, that it that that what they were talking about was the bond between the two of them. Yeah, and just like that's a great point, guys. Like just that moment and the mutual support and admiration and respect that all kind of what was demonstrated in that you know very subtle move that that that we cut to. That was just a great, great moment for sure. For me at least, it was and and the biggest challenge um throughout this process um for part two was kind of this this convergence of all these timelines, which made this edit like 10 times as hard as the first one. Because what I mentioned before, like with part one it it was was Barry's uh voiceover and his storytelling that was the Spina story. But um we all kind of agreed with part two that it would be interesting if the restoration was kinda the spine of this story. So we have three timelines happening at the same time. You have uh Barry um telling his story and and Lori um watching it with him and the first one and then you have um the restoration of the watch itself and then you have this um impending uh arrival of of uh of christoph arriving so that's what kind of happens with this is that they all this moment all converges and then um I had that moment as as Christoph is walking to to meet them, he says, um, as I mentioned before, um, you have the story that's behind the watch, beyond the watch. It's not just an object, it's a whole world of history, stories, and human relationship around it. And um that's that's kinda what I wanted to lead the audience right before they all meet for the first time after you know half a year or so or whatever it was and kind of built it up to that crescendo. So that for me was a special moment to execute and it wasn't easy, but um uh I'm glad uh we nailed it. If we if we could just talk a little bit about Davy's editing process here and how many years were taken off of his life um throughout this process. You know, really just deserves so much praise um, you know, for for the work that he did here and how and how this came how this came together. Really kind of a special thing. Um, you know, I was getting uh messages at three in the morning, hey, what do you think of this? I'm doing this, uh, what do you think of this track? You know, all this kind of stuff. So he didn't sleep much. Uh he's a dad with two young kids. He was moving houses. Uh he really put in a uh yeoman yeoman's effort here. So yeah. Much appreciated. I'm I'm literally um texting them as we're recording. Um like um if you're gonna come inside, uh please be quiet and go straight to the kitchen and eat dinner because we're recording this podcast. So that's yeah, good luck with that. That's what the process was really like. It was working on it from uh eight or nine at night to three or four in the morning, and then showing up for the editorial meetings, like half awake, and then kind of just like doing the homeschooling and quarantining um in the middle of the day and then having my own mental sanctuary at night. It's incredible, Davey. It really I mean, we'll we'll said said it before, but this is this is one one hell of a project. Like really, really one one amazing thing. Uh all right, I'll I'll finish up with my favorite favorite scene and then I've got one more question to ask you guys before I let you all go. But uh I think my favorite moment is is and it was referred to earlier but is this this final shot, this final meeting uh in part two and there's this amazing scene, you know, I give I'm I'm gonna take a wild guess here and say this was Gray's shot if I've if I've correctly figured out his style here, but there's this close-up of a bunch of hands, and at first you can't quite tell whose hands are whose, and there's this moment where Lori hands the watch back to Barry and Barry puts it back on his wrist on the original bloodstained strap. And it's like even just talking about it now, I'm I'm like tearing up. It's it's such a powerful reversal of the moment that set this whole story in motion fifty oh I guess fifty-one years ago now. Um and it's it's just it's it's almost like you get this moment at the end and you know, Davies hit the rewind button and somehow it's gone beyond our footage and we've gotten to watch this this passing of the watch in reverse today in color. And and to see these two men interacting and Christoph is there as well. And to have him put this watch back on his wrist with Lori there next to him is is unbelievable. And like I I just it's it's a shot that all the planning in the world could could set this up, but for it to play out like this and to have these guys feel comfortable doing this and and this be a natural part of the story is is something that like we can't take for granted. Like I uh you know I think for people who don't do this kind of thing for a living, like sure you could storyboard this out a month ahead of time, but like that that's not going to get you the shot. You know, it it the magic has to be there. And I I think there's something really special about this not just us capturing it, but this having happened. Um and and it sort of makes it all feel right to me. Uh, like like all of this was meant to play out this way, and it it all sort of ends in harmony in a in a certain way. Um, and I I have watched these videos both both parts many many times and this is one that just every time it happens I'm just I'm I'm blown away every single time. Yeah that's well put Steven um that's a a nice moment. I r I remember there you know uh in in the scene when when uh you know gray wanted to get this sort of video portrait which you see at the end of the uh at the end of the video as the as the sort of closing shot. And I I remember the guy saying, All right, well can you just take a picture of us? You know, we just want like a photo to remember this spot. You got your fancy roaning out here getting your shot. Just take a picture, please. Oh man. All right. So let's let's wrap this up. Uh I I wanna ask the last thing is is what impact these kinds of stories can have on our our community and sort of the broader, you know, broader community, I guess, you know, the the world at large. But real really we've touched on it. We we spend a lot of our time focused on on stuff, right? Like we're we're telling stories about products. We're telling stories about objects that may or may not have have some amount of cultural significance. But like this this is a this kind of ticks all the boxes. It's it's about people, it's about history, it's about culture, it's about consumerism, it's about products, it's about stuff, it's about restoration, it's about all these things. And and what do you think we can kind of contribute to the community by telling stories like this? What's the the long term impact, I guess, of something like this. Yeah, I'll I'll jump in here. You know, as you said, we tell stories of watches as as objects, you know, you know, for the most part. And and going back to the beginning of this conversation, this was special and unique because this is a human interest story about you know two people separated for a long period of time and and and being reunited. Um and in that sense, this type of story um I think resonated with many people beyond and continues to resonate with people beyond the watch community. So I think it expands our reach to people beyond hardcore collectors and vintage enthusiasts and whatnot. And enables us to tell future stories to a wider audience because they you know are aware of of who we are and what we do and and the quality of with which we do it. So everything we do I always look at as a building block for you know for the next thing. The only problem here is that this is going to be a difficult one to, you know, to to top. These stories just do not come along. So that's on us. That's our responsibility. And we're gonna do everything that we can to uh to create good stories like this. So if you know listeners out there have any tips for us, um as always, you know, send them to Steven. Have you seen my inbox, Will? That is that is maybe a dicey, dicey proposal. Luckily not. Luckily not. Alright. I'm gonna I'm gonna say my last piece and then we'll let people go. Uh I w I wanna echo what Will just said, which is I'm I had I I will say this as somebody who had basically nothing to do with making this project. But with that giant caveat. Um I am immensely proud to work for a place that that produced something like this. I'm immensely proud to be part of a community that welcomed a story like this and really took it to heart. And most of all, honestly, I'm super proud to work with the four of you guys and and everyone else who who put this together. This is really one hell of a piece of of journalism and of storytelling. And you know, I know how hard the four you guys work on on everything we put out the door, but the the level of of care and empathy and attention to detail and fastidiousness and like everything that you guys put into this just shows like a a tremendous care. I mean care is is the word that I keep coming back to here and and the the ability to take something that meant so much to these these two human beings and to treat it that way and to treat it with that level of of respect and attention um I think is a really special thing and I I think it's you know it it not to make make too much of it but it it really brings me back to like why I got into doing this in the first place, like why I wanted to be a journalist. Um is that I love people and I love hearing people's stories and I love the idea that like my job and all of our jobs is to amplify those stories and to tell them and to bring an audience to them. And I think this really encapsulates all of that. So my my main the the main emotion I come away from from this with is is pride. Pride in these two amazing guys, pride in in the four of you and everyone else who put this together. And uh yeah, I like James. I'm I'm eagerly waiting for the next one, uh, the n the next time that we get to tell a story like this, you know, and and not one being better than the other or equal to another, but just an another chance to do something big and ambitious and and empathetic like this. Yeah, I think it's it's a pretty special thing. Thank you guys for taking the time to do this. Uh and and you know, I know you have all already spent a lot of time with this project. So putting another hour and a half in now is is really appreciated. Thank you, Steven. That's that's very well put. And thanks to to the team for for all your efforts. All right. Awesome guys. Thanks so much. Thanks Steve guys.