In-Depth With James Stacey (HODINKEE Senior Writer)¶
Published on Mon, 10 Feb 2020 11:00:34 +0000
His number one goal? Don't be bored.
Synopsis¶
This episode features an in-depth conversation with James Stacey, a prominent editor at Hodinkee and co-host of The Grey NATO podcast. The discussion traces James's journey from his early life in Ontario, Canada, through various careers including computer sales, banking, and technical support at a cable company, to ultimately pursuing his passion for watches full-time. James describes himself as perpetually bored, always seeking experiences at the extremes—whether photographing sharks underwater, driving fast cars, or exploring remote locations like Clipperton atoll. His entry into watch journalism began with a Columbia field watch needing a battery replacement, which led him down a rabbit hole of research and eventually to writing for WatchReport.com and later aBlogtoWatch before joining Hodinkee.
The conversation explores James's philosophy on watch writing, emphasizing entertainment and personality over pure technical specifications. He discusses memorable projects including the Tudor Black Bay GMT collaboration, his Explorer review, and the Clipperton expedition with Oris. James shares his evolving perspective on microbrands, expressing increased caution about crowdfunding campaigns while maintaining support for established small brands like Halios. The discussion touches on his expanding interest in gold watches, his thoughts on the parallels between the automotive and watch industries, and his passion for other pursuits including film, photography, whiskey, and adventure travel. The episode concludes with a rapid-fire round of favorites, revealing James's preferences across categories from cameras (Leica Q) to films (North by Northwest and No Country for Old Men) to his ultimate watch picks: a Patek Philippe 5164A and a vintage solid gold Rolex GMT-Master.
Links¶
Transcript¶
| Speaker | |
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| Unknown | James Stacy, what's what's really your deal? Uh huh. Like wh why are you the way that you are? I'm really bor |
| Unknown | ed. I've been bored since the moment I was bored. By the way, we're not running this. |
| Unknown | Hey everybody, I'm your host Stephen Polverant and this is H |
| Unknown | odinky Radio. Gray, what are we up to this week? This week on the show we have the next in our series of editor interviews. We've done a few of these uh already, but this is where we sit down with a member of the Hodenke team and get a sense of their story from them in their own words. Ooh, who we talking to? Mr James |
| Unknown | Stacey, Mr. James Stacey. I think most people listening to this show probably think they know James pretty well. He's been a part of the Hodinki family for a while. He hosts our sister podcast, The Grey NATO. But there's a lot more to James from his time growing up in Ontario, Canada, to really pursuing his passion for watches while he had a day job at a cable company, to then quitting that job and pursuing his passion full-time, which I think is something a lot of us really dream about and |
| Unknown | he |
| Unknown | Yeah, nobody can tell James's story quite like he can, so uh how about we just get into this? Hey, you're the boss. This week's episode is brought to you by the Hodinky Shop. Stay tuned later in the show to learn more about how the Hodinki Shop is changing the watch buying game. For more, visit shop.hodinky.com. Mr. James Stacey, man, the myth, the legend. James Stacey, editor, interview. Okay. Coming in real hot. Where did you get on? Coming in Coming in like that lunch that you like put in the microwave for forty five seconds, you take it out, you think it's done, right back in. Well you're so hungry, you're like, I'll eat it cold. Yeah, whatever, fine. I loosened it up. It's not cold, cold. Yeah, I loosened it up. |
| Unknown | All right. So off to a good start. Well caffeinated stream of consciousness. Start to what should be a very concise non-Rambly podcast. This is good. |
| Unknown | Concise and non-Rambly are our specialties, right? That's what I'm known for. Yeah. Uh what you are known for, what I think our readers actually know you for, is you're a uh sports watch loving m,icro brand, interested, gold curious, uh watch aficionado who writes with uh just the right amount of attitude, I would say. Uh, but before that, I wanna go back to the beginning and tell people a little bit about your story that they that they might not know, the part of your story that was not all over the internet all the time. Uh where are you from? What's your what's your backstory here? Who who was James Stacey before he was James Sta |
| Unknown | cey? Uh yeah. I mean uh I I grew up in uh near Hamilton, Ontario, Canada. Wait, you're Canadian? Yeah. Yeah, yeah. I hide it well. It's all about perceptions. Um but yeah, uh I grew up uh technically for those who know southeastern Ontario, I grew up in a little town called Caledonia. Okay. So like six people who are listening to this know know what that is. Yep. Yeah, five plus my mom for sure. Cool. And uh yeah, just kind of like I was raised in like a normal middle class ho |
| Unknown | usehold, kids everywhere. When you were that kid, grown up, second oldest, six kids, small suburban town, like what did you want to be when you grew up? Like what'd you think you were gonna do |
| Unknown | ? As my mom's pointed out a few times, like I literally there's literally like uh crayon drawings of me taking pictures of sharks underwater. Seriously. Oh absolutely for sure. Yeah. So uh that would have been you know, nineteen ninety-one and in two thousand and fifteen, I guess I actually did that. Um or two thousand fifteen, two thousand, hard to remember the year. Like again, like we were joking with Ben, I'm sure we're gonna cut that segment. Um we we were joking with Ben he. He walked in while we were sitting here and he asked me, like, what's your deal? And my deal is kind of like I'm bored. I've been bored all of the time. Just always. Yeah, but like you think like taking pictures of sharks underwater, how are you bored? Driving a car really fast. How are you bored? It's funny because there's all these different passions that I'm interested in, but I'm only interested in the end point. Like if you think about if you're if you're like, oh well, I for a while I was gonna be a cop. Oh, James Stacey cop. Yeah. I I can see that. I don't know if I would have passed some of the like psychavals or or the rest of it. Like could you be a mounty? Uh I mean that's that's pretty high-end cop, and I think that would have been the goal. Like, I think if you're gonna take camera if you're gonna carry a camera around, do it underwater around sharks. If you're gonna drive a car, it might as well be a a sports car or a race car, an F1 car, something like that. If you're gonna fly a plane, it should be an SR-71. And if you're gonna be a cop, you might as well be SWAT or or or or something to that extent. And I think that would have been the again, it's it's not so much like I don't I genuinely don't think that it's like an adrenaline thing, it's like a boredom thing. Like I think I was I was born bored and I'm just kind of fighting. I'm fighting back that. Trying so hard every day to not be bored. Yeah, for the most part. But I guess I I don't aspire. I don't I never aspired to have anything normal. |
| Unknown | So you you've got the shark drawings, the crane drawings. But then like you're a little older than that, you're like in high school, you're thinking about what you're gonna do. Like at that age, what are you thinking? Like what's what's when you start actually having to think about like being an adult, like what's |
| Unknown | what's the plan? So I I didn't like school and I wasn't very good at it. Um de like decent putting a sentence together, but like math was really poor. And of course, like I'm sure lots of people listening know that they're of reasonable middle of the road intelligence, but like had a math teacher tell them that they're an idiot at some point and that kind of slows you down. Yeah. I had a couple great English teachers, so I really did appreciate the idea that you could take a brain that moves pretty quickly. And I'm not again it's not like an intelligence thing. It's a pace thing. It's a problematic thing. I I don't think I'm of any exceptional intelligence. I just think I I like I'm constantly looking for the next hit of whatever from this or that. Yeah. And uh and to slow that down or to make it into something that's like kind of concise, I do you can do through words, which I like quite a bit. Um and then yeah, I went to university with like zero plan of what to do, no real motivation. I just knew that I was kind of like expected to get a BA and I could afford it. I was selling computers at the time. I was always into computers. Um to make it really quick, if anybody uh you know doesn't want to doesn't dig through the history of my LinkedIn, uh I sold computers in university at a at a a precursor to what is now Canadian Best Buy or just Best Buy. There used to be Best Buy and Future Shop. And I worked at Future Shop. That's how I put myself through university and paid those sorts of bills. It was actually pretty lucrative gig if you're like university age and not really that interested in doing real work. Like I knew a lot about computers, so this was not difficult. Like to translate that to people. The the economics were in my favor at that time because it was a commissioned position. So you got paid only if you work. So I would only have to work enough to know how much I had to work that day because you saw how much you were going to take home. And then also like it's not that hard in a town with several colleges and universities to sell laptops all summer. They basically sell themselves. So it was like borderline free money. I wasn't flipping burgers, which is, you know, something I had my brothers and lots of friends that did, and that was not gonna work for my general mentality. Um I worked in a couple fast food places and that didn't last. I was fired. So moved into computers. Uh from computers, I finished up a BA and decided I needed a real job, so I went to a bank. Um, as you can imagine, somebody with like general boredom issues, the bank lasted like ninety-two days. Uh from the bank I wanted to Not that you're counting or anything. I did count. I remember I passed my passed my probation. And they're like, all right, congratulations. You're a financial sales representative. And I was like, I could just feel the walls closing in. I could just feel 'em. You know that you know that sound that that in two thousand one of Space Odyssey when all the monkeys are are like slamming bones on the ground and looking at the that's what I can Yeah. Yeah, yeah. It's a lot. Um so that was the bank. And from the bank I went into construction. I was in construction for even a brief more brief period of time only because I was injured. I really enjoyed construction a lot. Um, but I I managed to um cut the end of my pinky finger. It was like the smallest wound that would actually end a construction career for a summer. So I I I did cut it with a skill saw. I got I don't know 40 or 50 stitches in the tip of my finger. They were able to save the fingernail. I moved on. You don't see these images. You don't see the fingers in any of my wrist shots. It's okay. Okay. Um so I spent like a summer playing Metal Gear Solid and eating hot dogs with a friend of mine who was at the time independently wealthy. Uh it was a great summer, one of the best of my life for sure. Uh there's a hot dog truck not that far from my house. I could eat hot dogs with a bandage on my finger. It was good. I like a hot dog. Why not? Anyways, uh went from uh construction into technical support with the cable company in Hamilton. Boy, it's really boring when you just list it. Um from from I was with that company. They were at one point called Mountain Cable. Then they were purchased by like the Comcast of Canada, Shaw Cable and I was with that company for like seven or eight years. I moved to Vancouver while working with them. And that was the job that I would quit to go essentially full time freelance uh a little over two years ago |
| Unknown | . Yeah. And and so you got to do that amazing thing that people fantasize about at their desks all day, probably many of them listening to this show. Is like you had a day job that was like fine, it was a good day job, uh, but you had this passion on the side and you were able to kind of like become a part of that part-time and then you were able to quit your day job to do it full time. So how did you get involved in this sort of like watch community at large and then more specifically sort of like the watch media community |
| Unknown | . Wasn't there a watch of yours that that was part of the impetus here? You were looking for like replacement parts or to repair a watch of yours and that led you to a a forum or two? Am I |
| Unknown | making that up? Well I needed I needed to get the um battery replaced for that uh Columbia. Uh so that that kind of led me down the rabbit hole of looking inside a watch and what's in there. You mind telling that |
| Unknown | story a little bit? Because it's a it's a you know, I think a frequent one as far as how folks get into this. They like you know look inside the thing and then realize that there's a lot more to explore here. |
| Unknown | Yeah, for sure. So uh if you go back a long, long time back into university, I had like a Columbia field watch is what I wore every day. And one day the battery died. And I don't think I had given it a lot of thought as to like what was keeping this thing alive. But uh at at the time, if I could if I could kind of sink my teeth into a new topic, especially one that's surrounded product and history and those sorts of things. Like watches do such a good job of I just went down the rabbit hole, you know, this is pre-Hodinky. There was maybe two or three watch blogs. There's watchy seek a time zone, a couple specialty forums, poor man's watch forum at the time. Rito was doing some great work there. And you know, went through everything I could read about anything. Uh this is long this is when I wouldn't have been working very much during that saw the the hotel summer with Jared. Yeah, summer of eternal sunshine. But the the hot dog diaries. I think I read I think I yeah the hot dog diaries for sure. So many french fries. Uh we we definitely own the movie rights on this. Nobody sniped this. Uh and I eventually found a uh a blog called watchreport.com, which is owned by uh a man named Christian. And I had essentially in the course of just a few days read everything that they had published. Like I became obsessed with the idea of mechanical watches and I was learning the difference between Invictus and Rolexes and Seiko's and everything else that you could write about for watches. All these brands I had never heard of. This is right. I mean, like this is um spring two thousand and seven okay so early days of micro brands internet uh micro brands you've got ocean sevens around you have air command you have or um uh air nautique, you have just a few of these brands. This is a prehalios, like brands that I got really obsessed with l years later were just starting. Eventually I read everything on that site over the kind of summer that I finished university and then they posted that they were looking for submissions, so I wrote a couple pieces on spec and sent them in and they published one about Panorai that would have been my first quote unquote published piece of watch writing that would have been my kicking off point to uh to dip back into watches as a kid. I had been obsessed with like Indoglow and Timex stuff and and that sort of thing and uh mechanical watches came just as I finished university. |
| Unknown | Yeah, and then you you eventually ended up writing for a blog to watch, which is when we met, I think. You must have been working on the water |
| Unknown | twenty twelve. Yeah. Twenty thirteen, something like that. Uh probably at first Basel um or around then like the first Basel that I went to um is where we would have met. And yeah, so I was with Watch Report for a little while and they kind of traded owners. I didn't really see in alignment with the next one. And then at the time I had uh had you know traded some DMs and and such with the folks that had a blog to watch and they were on the West Coast. I was in Vancouver, so it worked out as far as uh a timing and and kind of proximity scenario. So started writing for them and I was with uh a blog to watch for like six years. It was awesome. I learned a ton. They've uh Ariel and his team have always been fantastic to me and I have a huge respect for uh what they do and how they do it. And then when it looked like it was time for me to no longer have a kind of normal day job. I was starting to see um the financial side of of going out on my own and and the ability to say have eight or so clients to to make a month make more sense than it did to have a day job and then spend all of my free time and a lot of my time at said day job reading and writing about watches um kind of as a as a secondary. You kind of have to do this in a parallel um until you're at a point where your wheels are almost coming off the ground on their own, and then you just kind of throttle up and take the most that you can. And uh, and at the time that would have been a big split. So that would have been leaving a blog to watch, but it was also picking up into uh Nouveau magazine where I was a editor at large for automotive, uh coming on with a you know a certain amount of uh promised work for Hodinky and then some white label work for various jewelers around North America and yeah, I had kind of a spread at the time. Nice. Yeah, I I mean befor |
| Unknown | e we we fully depart from a blog to watch and come over to to what you were doing when you you started with Hodinky, um what's some of the work you did there that you're you're most proud of? Because you really that's where you kind of grew from like an enthusiast writing blog posts to somebody like really doing this like in a |
| Unknown | in a concerted professional way. Yeah. So the the role was different at at a blog to watch because I was also involved in producing other types of media. It wasn't just photography and writing. I was shooting and editing a lot of my own uh all of my own video reviews for six years., like a long time It'd be me essentially hugging a camera and and talking and then trying to put that together in various programs later. And I I learned a lot from that. I would say that the the kind of like hallmarks and standout to me would have been um the Clipperton expedition with Oris, which was a sixteen day sailing to the most remote coral atoll in the world. So you would think this is the mid literally the middle of nowhere. So if you look at the base of Cabo San Lucas, the the peninsula, and then just go down until you're essentially west of Nicaragua, that's where it is. Jeez. Middle at the most remote coral of toll in the world. And if uh visually, if you want to think about it. Imagine just just the tip of a volcano came out of the middle of the ocean. It's fresh water in the middle. Super caustic fresh water. You couldn't have like a cut on your leg or anything or go anywhere near as full of bacteria. 1978, Cousteau and his crew like flew in, set up a whole base camp, went diving in there, and like their wetsuits like melted. Wow. Shit. It's real gnarly. Super gnarly in there. Um anyways, we so we went there, uh it was it was the second, um, it's now uh maintained and owned by the French government. At one point, it was an American uh naval base, which didn't work out very well towards the end of World War II, um Mexican ownership previous to that, which also didn't work out that well with a sort of despot that brought a bunch of women there, and then they caved his head in with a rock. Um, it's cool place, super remote. Definitely looks like you're kind of like on a different planet if you couldn't see the water, but you almost never can't see the water. Like it's hunt sometimes it's 100 yards from the fresh water to the ocean. For a long time it was used for drug running. And now it's kind of like a spot for sport fishing because of course there's some shallow water around it um around this precipice that comes up in the in like thousands of feet of water otherwise. Um but it's all protected and there's a big box around it and they want to extend that box from kind of Clipperton all the way up to the Rivial Gaguettos, which is Socorro, and and that's kind of due west of Cabo. Um fantastic diving and that sort of thing. So we did uh to give you an idea, like you get on a boat, you get on a boat. I had never like been on the like open, I'd been on some cruises or whatever, like giant boats, but um you get on a boat, it's 90 hours under motor to before you like see like a couple palm trees stick up out of the ocean. Whoa. So you're just in the middle nowhere. They're basically like you can't have an accident. They didn't oxygen chamber on the boat. They're like, you need this to be like the chillest diving in the world, zero risk. If we have to call somebody, it's the Mexican Navy, they're gonna come from Socorro, it's four days. So you make an accident, like even an accident where you couldn't stop the bleeding on a relatively like chill wound, which is how the last person died at uh Clipperton a few years ago. It was like an unlicensed boat and the guy got uh like chopped his leg, I think, or something like that with a prop, like on the back of the boat, and they just couldn't stop the bleeding and he died. It's too far. Like the world's a big place |
| Unknown | . That's that's a good lesson to learn. This is also your dream experience based on the street. |
| Unknown | I've never been less stressed than like just living on this boat, eating Mexican food. Yes, dude. Your best life. I was diving four days. I was diving four times a day. I dove until I was getting nosebleeds. Like we were just like, I was diving as much as possible. I don't have the inner ear kind of pressure scenario for a lot of diving. Yeah. I love scuba diving. I dove a lot. Um and and will continue to do so. But like four a day is a lot. That's like two days at the gym. You're gonna get an injury eventually. Yeah. And uh and yeah, it was heaven. I mean like I'm out there, I'm reading. Because like Gray said, it's it's taking pictures of sharks. Yep, we were in the water with sharks. It was my first time like in the water. Well, uh that's not true. I we did we did some shark stuff in in Hawaii. It was my first time like where you were you were with sharks that maybe hadn't been around people. Okay. Uh so not sharks on a wreck that's frequented by divers every day. Yeah. Like LSU and Waimanalo Bay in Hawaii. That's probably the closest I came like you could just the black tip reef sharks everywhere. But these were uh Galapagos and Silvertips and Hammerheads and huge mantas and uh like giant muscle like Arnold Schwarzenegger dolphins that are out there in Socorro. Uh and and and just like an experience to end all experiences for me. Like it changed the tire it changed the taste in my mouth for the rest of my life. Like I loved being out on the edge and nothing. I love that my phone didn't work. That's so cool. Yeah. And then um so I mean that that post uh exists today on uh on a blog to watch and I'm sure we can link it, but it's a you know, uh several page long look at both the trip and a couple watches that I dove the actively dove with. Um a couple horse wat |
| Unknown | ches, of course. And uh one one of my favorite things you did at a blog to watch, and something I think you were working on it when we met was uh the like super intense Basel World vlogging that you were doing. Oh, ye |
| Unknown | ah. Yeah, so that was something I'd always wanted to do because I thought there was this huge deficit of trying to explain the environment of Basel World. We can talk about the watches so easily and so well, it's like that's what you have to do in this. And you can take a picture of the hall and like maybe 5% of your readership has been to a trade show and they understand the format. But even this is it's its own thing. It's di like I used to I grew up going to car shows. I've been to a ton of car shows. It's kind of like car shows, but it's also kind of not because watches are so tiny. And so it it's kind of like a weird space where a whole weird fake town springs up. And like it's it's one thing, like, because if it's car At one point it was seven or eight thousand exhibitors. Yeah, yeah, it was huge. Closet and some of them have like uh the square footage of a motel six. Yeah. Um, depending on how much money and what what their name brand is, right? And uh uh I wanted I wanted to try and like capture what it was not only to go and cover it, but to walk around that space and stay at that pace for five or six days in a row. And we we did at SIHH and and it went pretty well, but uh I don't know if it's something I would go back to again simply because it wasn't just one of the hardest things I've ever done in over a span of time. It was you know, it was twenty hours. You know, you you spend maybe eight hours of your day at the show, you spend the rest of the time editing and cutting and doing the images and writing the posts still have to go up, and then you'd get to the doing the video. You hear that, folks? Video ain' |
| Unknown | t easy. Alright, alright. Coronan over here. All my points. Yeah. You did all of that for a blog to watch, and I probably every three to four months would call you or text you and try to figure out how we could get you over here. Uh finally like you said when you decided to go full time with this we were to we were able to make this thing happen. Uh and you've been with us now, what like almost two years? Over two years? Uh yeah. I mean in different capacities. Yeah. Yeah. I think it would have been uh a little over two years. A little over two years, yeah. And uh you've done some pretty cool, pretty cool work here over that time if |
| Unknown | I uh may say so myself. Yeah I've been very fortunate with uh the the the stories that you guys have have kind of lobbed right right into my plate. I I wonder |
| Unknown | are there any that just like stand out to you immediately like off the top of your head is like your personal favorites. Like the ones if you were putting a portfolio together, like the stuff you'd put in there and say, like, this is my best work. This is the stuff I'm super proud of |
| Unknown | . Yeah, I think the the BBGMT project, which I can claim a piece of great, great claims another big piece of that. But that was, you know, that was our goal of taking uh credit taking in and Steven, I mean you're on that trip too and facilitating a lot of what we did. And it was it's a team lift. Anytime you see something that includes some video. Oftentimes here in the office, anytime you see any post. Had a couple people working on it, whether it's copy editors, photographers, etcetera. It's true. But with something like that, we really swung for the fence. So we went, we leaned pretty hard into the sort of uh Bourdain-esque aesthetic or not even an aesthetic but that overall format because we were talking about a travel watch and we already were doing some traveling. So there was a lot of like things that line up and people say to me all the time you guys should do more like that and they don't realize like it's vastly expensive like insanely expensive if we were doing that just to talk about one watch. We were doing a bunch of podcasting and a bunch of other meetings and a bunch of other content production. So it was like amortized across several different kind of outlets. Yeah. And and series. That |
| Unknown | 's shoot took it was what over the course of six days? Six days in three cities |
| Unknown | ? Well, I mean the the the shoot yeah the shoot itself was was limited to San Francisco and then we recorded a whole bunch of voiceover in LA and then a whole bunch of B roll was shot in New York. Um I I think in addition to the expense, I think the the lifestyle element of that shoot, it's it's a it's a swing or miss like proposition. Totally. I think we have we have released some weeks on the wrist where we forced the lifestyle element and it and it didn't fit the watch, it didn't fit the editor's personality, and the audience could tell. This is one where, like, in the moment, you kind of felt like things were coming together. James had a great concept for the watch. It's a very cool watch itself. Um and then you know, San Francisco as a backdrop ain't ain't too shabby. Yeah, I |
| Unknown | mean James like taking a ferry and going for a hike in the Marin Headlands, wearing a sport watch, taking a bunch of pictures, field jacket on, like stopping for a glass of whiskey in the mission at the end of the day. Like that's that's a pretty good uh pretty good summary of what that watch is, what it should be doing, uh, and kind of how |
| Unknown | to live with that product. And the the B roll that ended up on the uh the cutting room floor. Lots of lots of good material that might make its way to uh sizzle reel at some point or or or or blackmail, either way |
| Unknown | . I mean both on any project I work for. Yeah, same. Same. Um but yeah, so I mean I th I think stuff like that, like the there's some big weak on the wrist that I'm pretty proud of. The explorer uh piece from last year, I think came together really nicely. And that's a fun watch to write about because there's so much like hyper accessible history with the Explorer. Yeah. Like with the BBGMT, there was no precursor. They were, it's essentially like Tudor looking back at the concept of a Rolex travel watch and making their own expression. And I think they did a beautiful job within that framework. But when you're talking about the explorer, you're talking about like the sports watch. So there's just so much meat on those bones. You can go in ten different directions with it, and we are able to kind of lean a little bit into the space of like the reference points with you know talking about each generation. And uh and then yeah, just just like a solid look at a sweet watch. That's one |
| Unknown | that I the thing that impressed me as one of the editors who worked on that project with you is when you filed that, I was like, I have I have no idea where this is gonna go, right? Because like you said, there's so much accessible history and there's so much there. The hard part of that story is not knowing what to include, it's knowing what not to include. Uh, and I think you did a really good job on that kind of like pulling out like contextualizing this that like this is a review. This is not a full historical guide to the explorer. This is the history you need to know to appreciate the watch you can goes kind of buy in the store. Yeah it's. It's context and it had an air of practicality to it. Uh and you made the watch feel I think less like a sort of like quote unquote like iconic thing that like sits in a display case, and you have to be reverent about and more like a super cool thing that like if you have the money and are at all inclined to buy it, you should probably just go out and buy it. Like you're gonna love it, it's awesome. This week's episode is brought to you by the Hodinki Shop. The Hodinki Shop was created by Watchlovers for Watchlovers. It started way back in 2012 with a handful of watch straps and travel pouches, and it's grown to include dozens of strap options, tons of travel accessories, the best watchbooks and magazines, outstanding vintage watches, and some of the most desirable modern watches on the market today. It's truly a full service destination for anyone interested in watches. In addition to stocking the products you want, the Hodinki Shop is committed to making the discovery and buying process itself as fun and convenient as it can be. You can browse and shop anywhere in the world, directly on your computer, tablet, or smartphone, and the incredible photographs ensure you get a vivid, accurate look at whatever you're considering. It doesn't stop there though. Once you've ordered a watch, you can count on complimentary, expedited shipping to get it to you as quickly as overnight. An extra year of warranty is included at no additional charge, and all of your paperwork is stored digitally, so you don't have to sweat losing those precious papers. Importantly, when it comes to modern watches, the Hodinki Shop is an official authorized retailer for all brands it carries. This means you're guaranteed to be getting a brand new, fully authentic watch with its full warranty. There's no funny business at all. The experience is truly best in class from top to bottom, and it's what the Hodinki shop thinks 21st century luxury is all about. To learn more and to take a look at the full range of watch Alright, let's get back to the show |
| Unknown | . Can I ask the two of you a question? Yeah. So if you are giving advice to like a prospective watch journalist or I guess any kind of writer covering you know product for enthusiast media. How do you guys approach writing a week on the wrist or a hands-on? If you're handed a watch, what are what are the initial thought processes as you come up with with your angle |
| Unknown | ? Hmm. Mine mine I always just look for a bit because I think I think all you're asking for is for someone to read it and like the things they want to know about the watch aren't that interesting. The size, the movement. Like, I think it's all important. Yeah. But like I think I think it's adding anything more that would keep someone reading past paragraph three when I'm gonna put the size of the watch in. Or maybe if I'm getting like feeling zesty would be in paragraph four. Mm-hmm. Um so like could I could I make it and I I don't think funny, but could I make you smile? Could I make you think about something you haven't thought about in a couple years? That's kind of a favorite move of mine. Like some not non-sequitur, but if I can make like a hard turn into something from my childhood, I'll make that turn, even if it's just a throwaway sentence. Because it's what I like when I read stuff from my favorite automotive writers. It's that they can they kind of it's it's not so much this whole like weaving a tapestry, but it's like there's there's a road and there's a direct way to write something, like a there's a straight line, that's your press release. Uh press releases are never straight lines'.re They Yeah, they're really in the clouds. They're squiggles. But yeah. But there's you know, there's a straight line which is just the specs and the price and and some nice photos, and that's where you have to start with straight line. But like I I w wanna takannae tak youe you, off the highway. We're gonna go down a couple of good roads, we're maybe gonna go a little bit too hard into a couple corners, make a couple mistakes, cross the yellow line a couple times and then get pulled over. Well, it could happen, yeah, for sure with me, no doubt.. No doubt Uh but yeah, I think I think like can basically how can like I don't write for I I do obviously write for Hodinky, but I think Hodinki's goals and my goals are aligned to such that I don't have to be concerned about that connection. But I don't write for a brand. Um, I'm not genuinely concerned if if a PR person is gonna write me and say, like, why did you say this? This doesn't make any sense. That's a dumb reference. Why would you connect my fifty thousand dollar watch to a fast food burger? Like, like whatever whatever whatever move you made, like I don't really care. Like that happened, without a doubt. Um but I I do really care that if somebody would read it, that they're at least entertained. Yeah, I agree. Think about everything else that you're that that ping notifies on your phone, which I consider to be like, you know, your push notification is like your holy grail of what you would you believe you would like to hear. Yeah. And so much of it is just like depressing hard truths about reality. And I'm not saying ignore those. That's the way I operate. I'm not saying everyone should do that. But maybe when it comes to things of enthusiast topics, just have fun with it. Yeah. Try and have a fun. Try not to be too serious about it. I definitely try not to take my myself too serious. Like I take the work really seriously, but I don't think like I don't think I'm doing anything that anyone else here couldn't do |
| Unknown | . Yeah. No, I honestly I think about it really similarly to that. Like I tell people all the time we are as much entertainers as we are journalists and reporters. Like most of us have some kind of journalist journalism training um or sort of like some kind of guidance in like how to report out a story, how to do this kind of like in a way that's ethically sound, in a way that's structured, whatever. And like that stuff's all important to being able to get stuff right and do it and and like present it in a way that's sort of palatable for people. But ultimately like we I don't think like me telling you about the Rolex Explorer is gonna like make the world a better place. But like I can put a smile on your face and that makes the world a better place. Or or it's a half an hour, 40 |
| Unknown | minutes, or whatever where you like you're not worried about your deadline for the day or whatever and like that's that's really my only goal I would say that the thing that it took me more than a decade to learn is there is a point where you can you can have the fun in the article without presenting any bias. So I can have as much fun writing an article and hopefully the person wouldn't would see that fun I have in making it and have no impression of whether or not I actually care for the watch. I can like it. I'm never I would never buy it, but like being able to write about anything with the same effect as writing about something you really like. Like an explorer is super easy. That's not a hard ass. Right. No, no, no. And I I typically get handed a lot of watches that I already am on that side of it. Like I'm on their team. I would stand for said watch, but uh the skill where it's a job, where it's like something you you can kind of work out is having a perspective about something that you're personally not that interested in. And the perspective is more than this sucks because X, Y, Z. This sucks because I feel this way, this way, or this way. Yeah. So it's it's a little bit more of an appreciation for competition. That's one of my favorite things to write about when I do a hands-on is I used to only think in terms of price, but it's so much weirder than that. It people buy things on like specifically, you have to look at like, okay, so if this watch exists in this realm, what might somebody actually cross-shop with it? And the spread could be thousands of dollars in any direction because the person's buying way more for emotion than they are for what it costs. If it costs, we'd all wear Iron Man. Like it's it's not a it's not a money thing. And that's like people will go into the comments and say like I can't believe this is fifty grand. And I'm like, you need to say there's another half of your sentence. I can't believe this is 50 grand because this is 35. I can't believe this is five grand when this is fifteen hundred. And if those two things have like the same appeal and could speak to the same buyer, then I buy you. But if you just say I can't believe this is fifty grand because I hate it, you're at a starting point, not at an ending point |
| Unknown | . Yeah, no, I totally agree. And I I think your point about kind of like what we do for a living that people may or may not understand, uh, is like our goal with most stories. I would say the the not full exception, but partial exception would be things like week on the wrist, because there's a real reviews, is like when we write a hands-on story or even a value proposition story or whatever, like it's not a review, like and we don't call them reviews for a reason. Like it is service journalism. Like what we are trying to do is give you a sense of what this thing is, a sense of if you're the sort of person who might be inclined to like it, why you either would or would not like it, like what are the pluses, what are the minuses, provide some sense of objectivity. Of course, our own tastes creep in, and that's a good thing, I think. You know, some personality never hurts. But like we're we're not writing a full review, like positives, negatives, technical analysis of every single watch that comes out for good reason. And a lot of that is like you don't need to purchase a mechanical wristwatch for those reasons. Like there's a reason why car reviews are so important is because like a car has safety features. A car is a thing that you like put your three-year-old in the back of and drive down the highway at 60 miles an hour in. It's a thing that gets you to your job. It's like there are stakes with a car. Whereas like with a watch, it's ultimately yes, it costs a lot of money. And yes, like it's a thing you should be invested in in some way. But like it's really about having fun and it's really about enjoyment and it's really about participating in sort of like a shared culture together. |
| Unknown | It's an emotional purchase. Yeah. It's not a practical one. You you buy a car for a practical reason. If you're very lucky you get to buy cars for emotional reasons. Or or you buy art or you buy you if you're in a position to buy things for emotional reasons, it just makes sense to have somebody who might be in the same emotional headspace as you give you a run of the land. And I think that's the point. That's the point of what reading of seeing everything we post in the span of the week, reading the stuff that's important to you. Yep. And and and might speak to you. And occasionally just attaching yourself to a writer who you think might be on your side if you were to sit down at the bar, that'd be the guy you'd end up talking with for the whole night. And just reading everything that they read because they're going to expand your your position. This is how I've learned about cars. This is how I've learned about music. This is how I learned about movies. Is attaching to personalities that I think I'm like 90% of the time, I know what they're going to what direction they'll go in something, and when they when it's that 10% and they they turn left and I was thinking right, you learn something. Yeah, agreed. U |
| Unknown | h I want to make sure we touch on, I mean, we've talked a lot about this like theoretically, uh kind of engaging with watches as a professional, but like also you you own watches, you buy watches. Um common common myth, and I think we've dispelled this on every one of these editor interviews, is like we do not get piles of free watches. L theike watches you see us wearing here are almost without exception watches that we have paid for and in almost all cases paid full price for. Um so like I want I want to know a little bit about your watch collecting. So when what what is kind of the first watch you remember buying and being like, this was this was an important th |
| Unknown | ing? Uh the like either an SKX double seven or or a black monster. Okay. Uh it was early 7S based Seiko stuff. At one point, you know, I would I would just buy pretty much anything that was like easily easy to buy. Okay. It was just a question of like getting an idea for what was good just because 100 people on a what you should buy under 150 dollars said that this is what you should get, like my wrist could be different, my tastes are different. I wanted anything that glowed in the dark, you know, that was a dive watch. This is pre pre-might time actually scuba diving. Um and then the rest of it is just like I would follow whims. It could it could be the whim of another of another person, like somebody else who has a bunch of stuff and you would borrow something from them and kind of learn a little bit. But a lot of it was just like discovery and be and when you don't have to buy insurance for them and you don't have to put them in the garage and you don't have to put fuel in them and you don't have to like there's like the maintenance costs and the general living costs of watches until you're at a very high price point where like you do need to insure them and put them in a garage of some sort or a safe or whatever. Until you're at that point, it just isn't that expensive of a hobby aside from what you actually decide to spend things on, spend money on, the actual watch. There's not a lot of like ancillary costs, some shipping occasionally. Um so it was just a question of like how how much could I get in a few years. Okay. And |
| Unknown | then how did your how did your collecting grow from there? Like what what were the kind of like stages of evolution and when do we start getting |
| Unknown | Yeah, I mean I still I still have my SKXs. Uh I think those are rad. I wear them a lot. Um you know my taste very much went towards say 40-ish millimeter steel GMT watches, of which I've owned a lot. Um but eventually eventually you hit an end game of some sort, a d a watch that you don't want to get rid of, you don't want another one of, and then for me that would have been you know three-ish four years ago. Uh my explorer two, yeah, which is uh a white dial 16570. It's my favorite Rolex of of any modern concept at all. It's a thin, it's a s the older, smaller case. This is a much later example, so I don't have the drilled logs or the creamed out loom plots, but I get a 3186 so you get nice anti-magnetic uh capabilities. Uh kind of the the the last version of that watch. And I mean they were I used to be able to recommend them because they cost like three grand. You know that those days are over now. So other than that, yeah, it's pretty much that. I got my hands, uh I always have a kind of stack of steel sport watches floating around. I got a big thing for Doxa, especially with the fiftieth anniversary. Um that's what I'm wearing now, one of one of mine, and uh the their fiftieth anniversary I think is like one of the sweetest watches under I don't know, it's it I think it sold for 2250, so it's one of the sweetest watches under 2251 in existence. Uh it's just like it's such a good watch. It's pure charm. Uh I know that's not an amount of money that like everyone can go out and pony up for a watch and and I recognize that extensively and so does Doxa they now make a watch for about 900 bucks. Um but I would say the real acceleration in my understanding of watches came via the kind of the the timing in which I entered really caring about watches was also a time when all of these micro brands started to pop up. So you got to experience good and bad watches really quickly. Um and and the the rate of evolution of some of these brands, the brands that have been able to keep their heads above water is is exceptional. |
| Unknown | Yeah, I mean that's that's something that you know I mentioned it at the beginning of the show, but like the the microbrand thing has become something of a a calling card for you, uh, you know, the Halioses of of the world. What is it that you find enticing? Because there are certain collectors who who are like diehard all in on micro brands, and there are other people who are like, I'm gonna stick to the kind of like big boys. Um what what do you like about it? |
| Unknown | In many ways, I would say that in the last two or three years my taste towards the entire concept has soured pretty extensively. I think that what used to be supported by small groups of pure experts on WatchUSeq and time zone. You know, the birth of brands like uh like Ocean Seven and Halios and um Benares and uh so many of these brands, that some of which are still around, uh, and doing quite well, those were those were vetted by people who were already deep in the game. As soon as it started to become something that was vetted by Indiegogo or Kickstarter, I have a lot of trouble feeling comfortable recommending product that I don't think is actually final product. And I get you get pretty tired of being told, like, no, this is it. And then you get it in, you're like, well, this is kind of weird. And they're like, Yeah, it's not done yet. I mean, like the the kickstarter thing's still going, so you know, we're only at a million dollars and we'll see how it sorts out and you're kinda like, All right, well, eventually if I do this enough times uh because personally I've been burned on Kickstarter for other I'm actively being burned on Indiegogo right now for product which I don't think I'm ever gonna get. And that's maybe $150. And that bums me out. So imagine imagine if imagine if there's a me, a 20-year-old guy that's just getting into watches and he write he reads something on Hodinki about how this Kickstarter watch is awesome for $450. And then that he puts down his $450. It's all the money he's got for watches for a long time. Maybe, maybe he sells a couple watches that he loves to get it. And then that brand torches itself or just shuts down. It says like too bad. And that owner on the other side he pockets 100 fifty grand or whatever, whatever the total was and files a few papers and starts another watch brand. Because there's not many cases where we know everybody's name. Like I with Halios, I know Jason, with uh brands like Raven, I know Steve, like these are I came up with these guys to some extent. So I I have some faith that if I say, like, yeah, if you put in the time and spend your nine hundred bucks on their watch, like you're gonna be really happy. Yeah. And and I genuinely don't believe, like, short of a complete breakdown of all the systems that keep these things in play, that they would that they would burn the credibility that they used 10 years to get. Whereas you have other brands, it's their first watch, they get half a million dollars or something on on Indiegogo, and like, good luck. And I just worry, I worry that like the the world where where it's the same. I just think it requires so much more scrutiny than it did a few years ago. So when we do it now, I think it's gotta be as thoughtful as possible. I want final product. Um, you know, like a br a brand, it's nice when it's a brand that you've you've seen them produce some other things like Baltic. Yeah. Uh, you know, they're making some great stuff. So there's not ex-I'm not saying that there's not examples now that are worth the same adoration and and and affection and support and and coverage as as a a halios or whatever. But I I think that it is a market where there's so many more players than there used to be. Yeah. Like think think about those, you know,, you you Steven're a sports fan, think about those times when you get teams, multiple teams in one city pop up. Yeah. They don't all stay around. They got to move somewhere else or they go away. Right. And I don't think it's necessarily that different for these watch brands. And the thing that bothers me again is there's not a lot of accountability in being able to follow the money to some extent. Where if it fails, you go like, all right, but like we know who that guy is, maybe, maybe he can make it right to the 50 people, but it's not 50 people anymore, 20 people. It's like it can be a lot of people that get burned. So that I've that weighs on me a lot every time that I get another email from a brand. You're like, this watch looks cool, it's the right size, it's got an okay movement, and then you go on their website and you're like, I don't know, you've definitely not made anything any b before. And like you're definitely sending out prototypes that aren't made in the same place that the final case and dial and everything are gonna be made. Like, if you show me final, I'm I'm I'm interested uh but uh very cautious these days. Interesting |
| Unknown | . I think what of one of the other things that that has changed in your watch taste that I've just seen as an outside observer is uh you mentioned you have just like piles of 40 millimeter steel sport watches. Uh |
| Unknown | you're now all about gold watches. Yeah, that's been the latest. And I think it's you know it's it's having it's having a couple steel sport watches that feel like an endgame to me. Like there there might be some that I want more than an explorer too, but we're talking about the them costing like we're talking about uh thirty nine millimeter Daytonas, which I can't afford. I'm not gonna be able to afford soon. I'm not didn't couldn't afford when they were cheap. Like th so like within the world of what I can actually buy, um I th I think like setting my sights on something that's far away but attainable and and I can work up to and learn a whole new side of watches is all is valuable on on multiple levels. But I do, you know, there's a few watches that I've tried on in the last few years where you put them on and it's like a whole different feeling, like a a new, like a new emotion, a new color |
| Unknown | . Yeah. You mentioned, you know, it also gives you something new to learn. And I wonder, you know, you came to this as a watch enthusiast first. How has doing this as a full-time job changed your relationship to watches? Because it's it's not a hobby anymore. Like this is this is how you put food on the table. Yeah, |
| Unknown | I think to a certain extent, like like f people who know me know that like at a certain point like I I trend towards being jaded about most things. Fair. I try not to make that my outward voice on a granado or or when I write because I don't think there's not a there's not a great connection between having an opinion and having a negative opinion. So on the internet it's a lot easier to have a negative opinion and make it seem like you're you're saying things other people aren't saying. But it could also be that that entire perspective could be regressive. You could be holding back other people from their best decisions, from their best work, from the best possible advice from a wider perspective in general. You know, there there is that kind of like, I'm angry, everybody must be angry, or I think this is dumb, so everybody must. And and when I really don't like something, I try and read 10 other opinions about it to try and see where where they lie. And some things are actually bad. And so and some things aren't. So I I do try and like I would say on whole, a lot of the the general scope, like it's such a big thing now watches and it was always big it's just I I've moved my way into the bigger part of it uh you know through maybe smaller tributaries on my way. But it's uh at some point I I tire of Of the |
| Unknown | structure. Do you experience uh watch photography Stockholm syndrome where you spend enough time with a product shooting it that by the end of like a full day locked in a closet with the watch, suddenly you find yourself falling for it a little |
| Unknown | bit? I I don't think I've ever had that scenario. I I think like um I've definitely liked watches more by the time I was done shooting them or I've I've liked them a lot less. But it usually comes down to how easy or how hard they are to shoot the if if the if I'm getting really nice work out of them, then I I feel like I like them better. Um, but that might be pretty face versus versus personality. Um I would say that for for the most part Shooting a watch is where I learn the most about it because there are these kind of obsessive details, especially when you go to edit the photos. Yeah. Um, which is such a huge part of the way that you you have to present, in my opinion, that you present watches online is is is a sort of like sustainable format so someone could go from one of your pieces to another and have like this kind of unified concept of what watches actually look like. Mm-hmm. Um and and I think that's the goal because it's it it is genuinely isn't that hard to make really beautiful images of watches. Uh their Instagram is full of them, but it's a different thing to make. I think it's a different thing, it's a little bit it's a different thought process to make something that that is editorial editorially sound. Yes. Um as far as what it captures. Um and and that means like if the watch is very reflective, maybe don't go to every extent to remove that crystal. Because the watch is going to be reflective on that person's wrist. No, I find that the photography is absolutely my favorite side of this whole thing, and uh it's definitely the way in which uh I because so much of like just picking up a watch and putting on my wrist is about the emotion that I feel behind whatever it is, what like what however it makes me feel, I can miss a lot of weird details about watches that I'll notice later. When you go to edit it, you start to see the fonts, you start to see some of the like spacing and proportions and and you'll even go in and start I'll do little masking and then realize like well this side of the case it's asymmetrical then I'll realize like oh the case is asymmetrical because look at this circle doesn't actually sit in the middle of where you expect it to. So there's little design things that like I'm I get better at over time, but a lot of it I discover in in photography in that part in that side of it |
| Unknown | . It's funny, you you said that the photography helps you with like sort of the technical details, but you know, the the other side of things is are those feelings that you said you get when you kind of experience a watch, right? And, you know, that's one of the things that we wanted this show to be about from the beginning is sort of like the feelings around watches, the culture around watches. Um, and it's something that you've been doing for a while too on the Great NATO, right? Like we have two podcasts here at Hodinky, both ostensibly quote unquote like watch podcasts, but neither one of them is really a watch podcast per se. Like they're both shows that talk about watches and in which the people on them talk about watches, but they they both deal a lot more with that like the sort of less tangible aspects, right? |
| Unknown | Yeah, I think I think like great Grey Nidto is largely just Heaton and I. Like I don't I don't be a whole lot more than that. We occasionally like we've we've tried to do interviews with other people and like they go okay, they're fine. Like you can tell by the numbers that people largely prefer 45 minutes to an hour and 10 minutes of Heat and I rambling about watches and a few other things that we like. Yeah. And and it's mostly and and and what I've learned is that there's nothing specifically special about Heaton and I, aside from the fact that we're willing to make the podcast, because I get emails from people who are into the same stuff at a higher degree than I am constantly. I mean, like the greenado at gmail.com it's just it's a constant influx of like mental and perspective support from these people who just like the same things. And and these aren't rational things to like for the most part. Yeah, I mean that's not you like them because I I don't like I just do. This is it's like why why one one food tastes better to me than another. It's it's not a decision. It's just it's wiring. I mean, that's the other |
| Unknown | side of this, right? Is like your your passion for quote unquote like these things extends way beyond watches, right? Cars, uh, film, whiskey, uh, adventure. Like what what what are some of the other things that you would say you're you' sreort of like |
| Unknown | most passionate about? Yeah I mean I I love podcasts. So that like that's been my probably my prime piece of media since university, like since the early days like This Week in Tech and uh Dignation and and these sorts of things like it it was the easiest way to be like nerdy while doing a second thing, driving, uh pretending to pay attention in a lecture, uh doing laundry, etc. Like you could I could I could keep up the pace of like not being bored by listening to experts tell me about things that otherwise I would have to sit and read and be focused on a sentence, a word, etc. Um and and and I love I love podcasting for that and and I have and will continue to uh devour as much as I uh have time to listen to. Uh beyond that, I you know, uh learning and getting more and more into uh photography at at a wider level and certainly, yeah, film. I adore cars. That's that's my most irrational love. Uh what's irrational that it? Yeah, I mean, I I think it's two different things. Cause when it comes to cars, and and I'm sure there'll be a couple people listening who remember me or know me from automotive press trips. Like I don't I've not owned a bunch of cars. I I'm not a car collector. I'm um I'm a uh like I would say a deep problematic enthusiast. It's the first news I read every day. It's the stats that I will remember when I die is like I got to write my McLaren F1 story for volume five. Yeah, you did. These are like, these are moments you close the door on a McLaren F1 and press that start button. And like I felt something that none of you that I can't explain to any of you that are listening. I only I actually think the only next level for that like boredom kill would be like dropping the throttle on an SR71, which is liter literally never going to happen. No amount of money could get me there. Attempt to explain that sensation to those of us like myself who are not gearheads. First mag first car magazine I ever got was from like a a a close family friend. Uh his name's Steve. Steve will definitely be listening to this. Um shout out to Steve. Yeah, Steve's the best for sure. But he gave me uh nineteen ninety two road and track with the McLaren F one on the cover, and it has always been like that car deserves every bit of praise. It I've never driven one. I probably won't, I probably came as close as I would for that story. But it's a you know $15 million car. You don't need some jabroni driving it who's popped up from a watch magazine. And uh that's not I don't at all mean that as any sort of complaint. I I don't need I don't think I need to drive one. I've I've loved this from the moment that I could like conceptualize half the words written by the person. I was like six, five or six when it came out. And uh and it's just something that I love, but it it's also something where like I know it's like actively as a human being, with like I can adopt other perspectives. I know it's dumb to love a car. I know it's dumb to a certain extent to like have legitimate like passion about something like watches, but I can't help it. And furthermore, I'm at the point where I'm not definitely not gonna try |
| Unknown | . How many counter-argument you hear? I don't think it's dumb at all. Whether it's a car or it's watches or it's sneakers or sports or furniture or anything else, stamps, coins, whatever, like whatever you're into. I just don't think you get to pick. |
| Unknown | Yeah, I don't think you get to pick them hardwired. Like I've always been uh uh nature versus nurture, but when it comes to cars, when it comes to watches, when it comes to like sharks or fish tanks or uh like hiking or what like I it's just this is what I'm wired to do. I'm I'm not saying it's good or bad. It th because I feel like it exists outside any concept we can add to it. You like what you like. I agree. And I think the reas |
| Unknown | on that it's not stupid is that these things push you to connect with something outside yourself, whether that's with nature and the world around you, or it's with other enthusiasts, or with the people who make things, like things carry a tremendous amount of meaning. Like there's there's this attitude that I think some people have that like stuff is stuff and it's meaningless, and to be interested in things is somehow shallow and dumb. But like ultimately things carry meaning because we as humans put meaning into them and we take meaning out of them. And like that is tremendously meaningful. And like whether it's you know, a car that like brought you to a new place to meet new people, or whether it's a watch that when you put it on, it makes you think of what somebody on the other side of the world was doing with it 60 years ago when they bought it, or 65 years ago when somebody was making it. Like that's that's a good thing. It teaches us to be outside of ourselves. It teaches us to be open to new experiences. It teaches us to be curious. Like, I think these things are in a very non-dumb way, like really tremendously meaningful with the caveat that like that is as long as you have that sort of perspective on them. Like if you're the sort of person who just wants to, you know, hoard expensive things for the sake of hoarding extensive things, like one could make an argument that maybe that's kind of dumb. But like I think when you have the sort of enthusiasm and when you say like I sat in this car and I pushed the ignition and like I felt something. |
| Unknown | That's a good feeling. And I think for me, like what it comes down to, the way that I would explain it to someone who who would make who could make a fair point that like these are weird things to attribute extreme passion to. First is like other people or art, for example. Um I would say like my my wiring leads me to extreme obsession for entirely non-casual things. So if it's a car, it's a McLaren F1, made by a genius, developed by four people, decades ahead of its time. If it's a plane, it's the SR-71, developed by a genius, the finest manager that's ever lived, uh, inclusive of any Ford. And 50 years ahead of its time, maybe. I mean, like designed on a napkin before computers could tell you if something would be fast. They couldn't actually buy enough titanium to make it, so they had to make shell companies to sp buy the titanium from the Russians, which they would then fly over the Russians to take pictures of them. It's just the best thing because they made no concessions for the fact that it might be dumb. And like a really great watch makes no concessions for the fact that it's anything other than a really great watch. And that's what a really great supercar is. It's like a you you sit in a McLaren 720, which is the car my life of video. It's a thing I'm obsessed with. I don't typically like find a huge amount of like emotional investment in a modern vehicle. I I have a huge emotional investment to the way they make me feel when I drive too fast. I like I like a car that makes my hands shake when I stop where like my hands sweat. Like take like right to that point where like I know I'm not a great driver and I'm I'm totally fine with that. That's okay. But like you go, you do a a four three in a brand new DBS on some Austrian back road to get around, you know, a fiat that's not moving fast enough. If that doesn't make like your pupils dilate, we are not the same human. We're we're like we're we've evolved in different directions. And I'm not definitely not more evolved because these that that device that device for that little bit of feeling it gave me burned a bunch of hydrocarbons with a huge V twelve engine and made a bunch of noise that probably bothered a bunch of birds and butterflies nearby. And I actually care about the birds and butterflies too. So it's like a conflicted person thing, but like I can't, there's no way for me to explain it beyond the fact that it's like I |
| Unknown | can't explain it. Yeah, I just love it. I love it because I love it. One of the things I wanted to ask you about is, you know, you're we talk a lot about how like car guys and watch guys, it's a lot of the same people. There's a lot of overlap, whatever. You've touched both these worlds professionally. And in my very limited experience touching these worlds professionally, since uh I've had my driver's license for less than two years. I've never seen you drive. I've never driven on a highway. Uh I nominally drive. Um yeah, so but in my my little experience and from just chatting with you, my understanding is that like in reality, at least in the media space today, like these worlds are actually very, very different. No? Super different. Yep. How I mean like what makes these things different? And |
| Unknown | what makes them the same for that matter? I think that so much of the automotive world is looking towards electrification, that which will be their quartz scenario. And I think like it's funny because watchmaking was around for a long time, pocket watches and such, and then it had big changes in terms of the ability for everyone to be able to buy one, right? Which of course happened to cars eventually. And then it became something where people who had more money could buy something that was vastly more performance oriented or design oriented or made by someone who's just willing to say that it costs more. And then you go through rapid development of resources and and technology, usually through a war that happened to both at the same time, but I would say watchmaking was less effective than automotive was by the war, shortages in steel, things like that, like really, really had an impact. And then post-war you had this huge boom, especially in the US, which became a car loving culture. Then you run into the highways, which changed cars forever, uh included the stupidity of speed limits and uh yeah James for the record is firmly anti speed limit uh yeah absolutely uh I'm firmly I'm pro driver education which North America does not do. I can't blame the states. Canada is no better. Uh but train train your drivers and they can drive faster. That's easy. And you could start with 16-year-old, their brains are faster than a 40-year-old. We'll all be okay. Um but I you know, I like the high speed limits in Texas, that's pretty cool. State does a few things, right? Did Stevie? Yeah. High speed limits. That's true. Texas forever, baby. It's got uh torchies. Does have the whole holy trinity right there. Oh man. Fast highways, tacos, and C VP. Um But yeah, I th I think that a a lot like I think this is an industry like the automotive industry can be related in some ways, in like some kind of fun ways if you're a writer to the watch industry. And I think they're just approaching their courts age, where we're gonna have more electric cars, we're gonna have cars that are that are gonna be more accessible to people who don't care about cars at all. They care about accuracy, they care about convenience. That's what quartz brought to the world. And then I think if you give it a few you give it a few years, you give it an age or two within its within its genre, a generation if you will, uh we'll we'll start to see a rebirth of new vintage vehicles. I like this take. Me too. I like this take too. And then from a people standpoint, they're the same. You know, the the folks that I met and and and are still friends with in the watch industry that are journalists, they love or in and in the the car industry are very much the same. They're there for deep passion. Passion they can't help. I don't I honestly don't think you get into like writing about or talking about watches or writing about or talking about cars like by accident. It's because you're you're kind of not wired to do a lot else. And you're able to create and you're able to to uh supply a market that wants something and you know what like if you can connect your ability and your need, your like unfounded, hard to explain need to make something back to a market that that would like to read it, then so be it. And I would say right now, uh is like if you're into cars, I'm not sure there's been a better time to be an automotive enthusiast. There's car shows everywhere. The best writers in the world are writing uh for either free or next to free outlets. Please subscribe to Road and Track. Everybody this is the second time you plug this. Without a doubt, I cannot like I just got the latest issue. It's in my it's in my bag, uh the twenty feet from here, and it's just it's it's Camisa and it's Sam Smith and it's uh it it's it's all these guys and they're it's way too good for what they're charging. Like I know that what we do not charge somebody like we do for the magazine for sure. Yeah. Um but I mean what's a two what what does it cost to get to two magazines a year? Thirty sixty bucks? Thirty bucks for a magazine? What is it what is a banana cost, Michael? I think it's thirty-five. Twenty dollars. Ten dollars? Yeah. You couldn't give your own brother a hodinky magazine. Um so whatever it is that we charge, like I like a like the the Roman tractor is vastly cheaper and like the best writers in the world. And then you look at like what happened with Top Gear. Now you get uh uh the Grand Tour and you get Top Gear but with Chris Harris at the top on on BBC and peop people like to say it's not what it was and like I I can't disagree more. There's so much value there. If you're into wat if you're into watches, if you're into cars, if you're into cameras, this is a sweet time to be like a nerd. And and I think if I was coming up at like if I was coming up now, uh I would say almost no doubt. Like uh a next wave, James would not have touched university. I I would have I would move directly into like uh passion-hbionas based content production of some sort. Nice. I like all |
| Unknown | these takes. Same here. These are good takes. Uh I don't know about that, but I feel like whiskey takes we could probably do this forever. But I think what we'll do is we're gonna mostly cut this here. We're gonna do episode two at some point. But before we do that, uh Gray and I were chatting ahead of this and you're you're a firm believer in strong opinions loosely held. It's become kind of your your mantra. So to go with strong opinions loosely held, Gray and I wanted to make you give a whole bunch of hot takes. So the idea is you get one. All right. I'm gonna list off some categories and you get one just fire from the hip? You get one thing in this category and it has to do you forever. Oh, I can't change. So you get you get one thing. So if the category is cars, you get one car forever. Oh, I see. Okay. So like like hot picks. Ye |
| Unknown | ah, yeah, yeah. Not really a take. It's the thing for you. In this very moment though, knowing that you as an individual change moment |
| Unknown | to moment. Yeah. But right now, if I made you pick, what of these various things would you take and it'd be your only one forever. He's in. Okay. Cars |
| Unknown | . Alpha male stradality of thirty-three. But I don't know if I fit. I'm six three. I've never sat, I've stood next to one and this is a car I've never touched that made me feel like starting the McLaren. It is an aggressively beautiful thing. If I don't fit, I'll put it in my living room. Perfect. And I'll drive my Jeep around. Camera. Oh, it's a Q. I mean that's easy. But um it whatever the new Q is, like if I'm if I don't work anymore in like if I don't have to produce content. Scare quotes content. Yeah. Flashy quotes content. Then uh um I lot I you know, I read uh a simple film camera. Yeah. Film range finder, I'm not that picky. All right. If I can afford like an M6 if the world changes and and M6s are like within range'.s go Let that range. But otherwise, like if I have to work, it's a queue. All right. That has literally changed my entire like professional existence in the last year. Perfect. Whiskey? Will it? Will it? Interesting. Yeah. All right. I'm not about like thousands of dollars a bottle, even if you're talking about like uh pick one and that's what you get. I'm not like Pappy's insane. All right. Uh Willet is just as good. It's still super expensive if you're a normal person who just wants to like enjoy a drink and and a uh great you know put on fleetwood mac or whatever in in the evening but like will it for sure. That's my next question. Record. |
| Unknown | One record. One record forever. Yep. All moods, all times, all seasons. One record. |
| Unknown | Hopelessness blues, fleet foxes. Ooh. Ooh. Has grown ocean. I just said it and I have a chill. I got a chill. Has Grown ocean. Grown Ocean I used to listen to when I first moved to Vancouver is the first time that I was ever like out of my element, away from home, on my own, in a new space, an entirely different aesthetic. I'm surrounded by mountains and ocean and I would I would go on walks um from my job, which at the time was like stressful and I wasn't sure it was like what I should be doing with my time. And I would find this like deep solace in walking around near the ocean, around other people who are just out to enjoy like a decent day in Vancouver, of which there's fifty-five a year. Yeah. If you're lucky. And yeah, growing ocean for sure. And seeing fleet foxes in Stanley Park in Vancouver was next level. Meal? That's a tough one. Yes, is this is his final meal or he eating the same thing like forever? Ooh, that's true. Yeah. It's a tough one because I'm not a foodie. So any of my answers, answers are gonna be like largely trash. All right, let's let's I'm a cereal man at heart. I haven't eaten cereal in years. What's your favorite cereal? There it is. Honey note cheerios. Oh. Strong or fruit loop. Fruit loop is |
| Unknown | great. Fruit loops for the weekend. It's a great Cheerios for the work week. Shirt lo |
| Unknown | ops are party Cheerios. So twenty twenty. I don't have party Cheerios. Wow that's good. Party Cheerios for sure.. |
| Unknown | Yeah Yeah. Um That's it. I'm done for the weird. But I mean, like, yeah, for I mean it's it's it's I mean it's probably my favorite meal, if I was in a new city, especially city that like could do steak, then it's steak freed. Okay. So if I'm in New York, that's Lucien first and first. I'm assuming if I say city, you're saying Vancouver. City forever. I could live in Vancouver and never leave and be perfectly happy. And and I say that as someone who like one of the deepest pleasures in my life is travel. Okay. What's your favorite book? Or one book forever? Blue Meridian. Blue Meridian. Yeah. Okay. Uh or I mean read any Matheson is what I would say. Okay. If if someone's gonna take like read Blue Meridian if you want, watch the documentary, which is called Um Blue Water, White Death, Peter Kimball, uh nothing less of a hero but uh Matheson. Blue Meridian is a gorgeous book also about finding the first great white underwater. I like that level of writing doesn't usually intersect with like adventure topics. Yeah. And that one, or Snow Leopard, which of course he won some very prestigious award that I'm blanking on right now. But uh yeah. All right. Magazine. I got two more for you. Fil |
| Unknown | m. One film for for it. We are both big fans of uh the rewatchables from the ringer. I don't know how the show is. Ultimate rewatch |
| Unknown | able. Yeah. I got to two real quickly, which seems like a couple of things. You can get both. That's fine. You can get both.. They're four Entirely different eras. So I would say north by northwest. Oh yeah. Um, which I've seen maybe I don't know, maybe thirty times. Movies incredible. And uh and and keeping keeping in my you know not North by Northwest is a long film, let's go with another long one, I would say uh it's tough. No country for old man. Ooh, strong choice. So it's a bummer because neither of those hit my favorite cinematographer nor my favorite director. Uh but I think if I I could I could probably watch No Country for Old Man like once a month for the rest of my life. All right. The older I get, the less I want to watch new things. Which it seems like a problem. It's that feels like attrition. Yeah. It's all right. Um, atrophy, if you will. Uh, but yeah, North by Northwest, if you haven't seen it, um, my favorite Hitchcock, not his best movie, but my favorite, absolutely, rope is his best film. Um, I completely agree with that, by the way. Should we do a whole episode about rope? Rope is insane. You two can do that. Crazy, crazy out on the rope catching. And then yeah, and then with No Country for Old Men, I mean it's modern film that plays like an old Western in terms of pace. It it feels an hour too long, but then when it's over you're like you're left with this like sense of dread and foreboding and emptiness. That last shot is stupid good. The whole thing. Yeah. Uh is great. And then yeah. I could go we could do another ten, so might as well leave it at two. All |
| Unknown | right. Uh last one, the obvious one, one watch. You get one. Your vacant stare into the distance. I love it. Tells me that this hurts you. Could we do like modern and vintage? Sure. Is that too much of a bend? Sure. I'll let you do modern and vintage. One modern watch, one vintage watch. Yeah. So it'd be a fifty one six |
| Unknown | ty four, you pick the metal. Yeah. Uh would be my modern. But I mean my the absolute like steel on the on the green. Yeah. I could probably wear forever. Kind of like a you're going A. Ye.ah 5164A. I think that suits my vibe pretty well. Tiffany's A. And I think I could be uh Yeah, sure. Sure. I could. I mean, I'm not that picky. All right. I like the Tiffany. It's not me. Alright. And then vintage at like uh solid gold GMT master too. Oh yeah. Ever sorry, a solid gold GMT master. Yeah, that's the move right there. I think that's the way I would go. Like kind |
| Unknown | of Castro spec. You go in uh Jubilee. Root beer, you go on black. Black black. Yeah. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Jubilee, o |
| Unknown | of. I blame I blame my my, you know, uh buddy and and uh and never ending source of uh Instagram fun uh James Lambdon he loaned me his for some time his uh brown uh rhubeer one dangerous thing to do. Yeah for sure. Uh it was kind of him. I was I was we we met in Miami last year and I was I was deck I was decked out in uh a solid Hawaiian shirt and he threw me this watch and I wore it for I don't know probably what a week and man if I could afford it, that's uh that's a like watches for me is is is a lot like cars. Like I think you you need the minivan, you need the the SUV, whatever it is, like to make your life functional. But think about what makes your life happy? What makes you like zesty to get out of bed? To not spend the whole day watching YouTube videos or whatever, like go go out and make like YouTube videos in front of your own eyes. Like make an attempt at least. There we go. Getting zesty. I have good days and I have bad days with that concept, but yeah, like uh a solid gold sports watch is so much fun. It's and it's so antithetical to the concept.. Yeah And and it really starts to lean in on the idea of like, are these things that we need? No. Are these things that like validate something about what it is to have our brain chemistry? Oh yeah. |
| Unknown | Perfect. Mr. Stacy, this has been real. My apologies. We're gonna have to do this again. I really feel like sticking my teeth in. This this could be like a six hour. Magnum opus, yeah, exactly. Yeah. Just a random random one for su.re We'll do part two, right, Gray? We'll see. Some maybe. All right. Let's look at the metrics. Yeah. Yeah. People listen to it. If you've listened to it enough, we'll let James come back. So at the end of the episode, this isn't valuable to anyone. Yeah, no there are seven people listening to this, and all seven of them are parents. For more information, click this link. Yeah, right. Swipe up. Thanks for listening, mom. Love you, mom. Love you, mom. Love you, mom. Writing on love you moms |
| Unknown | and not a triple love you mom. |
| Unknown | This week's episode was recorded at Hodinki HQ in New York City and was produced and edited by Grayson Korhonen. Please remember to subscribe and rate the show, it really does make a difference for us. Thanks for listening and we'll see you next week. |