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George Glasgow, Jr. (CEO, George Cleverley)

Published on Mon, 6 May 2019 11:00:20 +0000

The CEO of George Cleverley shoes shares his lifelong love of watches and how he ended up taking over (and loving) the family business.

Synopsis

This episode features George Glasgow Jr., the proprietor of London's prestigious bespoke shoemaker GJ Cleverly, joining hosts Stephen Pulvirent and Kara Barrett in New York during one of his biannual US tours. George shares fascinating insights into his month-long trunk show circuit across America, including the amusing revelation that he Ubers between Texas cities rather than flying, leading to some entertaining encounters with drivers who can't believe their fare destinations.

The conversation explores George's journey from growing up in the family business to briefly working in banking before returning to his true passion for bespoke shoemaking. He discusses how the business has evolved dramatically over the past decade, with the average customer age dropping from the sixties to the forties, largely due to social media and increased access to information about artisanal craftsmanship. George emphasizes that Cleverly creates a club-like atmosphere where customers develop personal relationships with the makers, distinguishing the experience from typical retail transactions. He also reveals his deep appreciation for Patek Philippe watches, particularly his prized Nautilus 5711, and shares an entertaining story about accidentally purchasing watches instead of an engagement ring during a wine-fueled shopping trip with Jason Statham. Throughout the episode, George's passion for craftsmanship, whether in shoes or watches, shines through as he discusses the importance of wearing and enjoying luxury items rather than storing them away as investments.

Transcript

Speaker
Unknown All of us have certain people in our lives who seem to keep popping up over and over again, no matter where you go, who you're with, or what you're doing. George Glasgow Jr. is one of those people for me. He's the proprietor of London's GJ Cleverly, which is arguably the finest maker of bespoke shoes in the world. I mean, name me a famous or important person from the last 75 years or so, and I can almost guarantee you that they had a pair or two of Cleverleys in their closet. George and I first met close to a decade ago when I was writing about classic menswear, and through a mix of mutual friends, overlapping businesses, and of course a shared love of watches, we stayed in touch basically the whole time. In fact, one of the earliest Todinki product collaborations was a limited edition set of watch wraps made by Cleverly out of this insanely rare Russian reindeer leather from the 18th century. But that's a story for another time. Right now, George is on one of his biannual tours of the United States to fit customers for shoes, and during a free afternoon in New York, I was able to get him into the studio along with our own Kara Barrett to talk about why he has a deep affection for Patek Philippe, the craziest shoe requests he's ever gotten. And that one time that Daniel Day Lewis asked his dad to be in a movie over lunch. Yeah, this is kind of a wild one. I'm your host Stephen Pulverant, and this is Hodinky Radio. Good to have you here, George. Thanks for joining us. Thanks for having me. And we've got uh Cara Barrett here too. Hi guys. So you're in town, George, for the beginning of a pretty breakneck month-long tour of the US, right? Yeah
Unknown , so I do these trips twice a year uh to the US. We start in New York, we do about a week here, and then we head over to uh San Francisco for three days, then on to LA for a week, and then it goes really throughout the rest of the US, so that hits up Austin, Dallas, Houston, Washington, Chicago, Atlanta, uh Boston, and then Toronto. So it's uh it's pretty lengthy. Yeah, that's no that's no joke. Do you take a do you take a bus or do you fly? Do you know what? It's actually funny you say that. So we used to fly everywhere and now when we get to Texas, we actually you can laugh at this, we Uber. Oh my gosh, between cities? From Houston to Austin to Dallas. So we Uber and we get you're so the first time we ever did it, so here's 'cause there's a few of us travelling and we have quite a bit of luggage. So I said, look, you know, go into the airport, the time it's an hour into there, then you've got the flight then you've got checking in, and then on the other side you want to, why don't we just Uber? It'll be three hours, four hours max. So you know, and obviously you book it on the app and and you see it there you put in where you're going. The the lady lady turned up and she said, Oh, where are you guys off to? This was in Houston and I said, No, we're going to Dallas. And she said, Oh, so you we're dropping you at the airport. I said, No, no, no, we're going to Dallas. So she started she started laughing and she thought I was like joking. And she goes, Oh, we're putting the luggage in. I said, No, no, really, uh is that okay with you? She said, You we not Dallas Street. I said, no, Dallas. And then so she goes to the front of her car, swipes, because they don't know until they start the app, swipes it, and she's like, oh my God, you're going to Dallas. I went, yeah, that's what I've been trying to tell you. So we're in the car, after like 20 minutes, phone rings. She goes, Oh, do you mind if I take a few calls? Because it's a long trip. I said, go for it. So it's our son. The son comes on the thing and says, hey mum, what time are you going to be home for dinner? She she goes, well I'm on my way to Dallas. And Dallas? It's like the same thing as before. What are you doing there? And apparently it was the longest fair she'd ever had. So we do this, um, and we've it's we've had some really interesting situations where Uber drivers have other jobs and they're like, Well I need to be back, I can't be gone, this is gonna take me eight hours round trip. So then you'll get some that cancel it and whatever. But uh but yeah, we Uber through that is wild. That's pretty crazy. Texas is huge. Yeah, Texas is gigantic. Is that like that's amazing. It's honestly it's it's really and I don't you know it sounds weird when you tell people like really did you do that? But it's actually the same amount of time as if we'd fly. But you're in the back of the car, right? You can do your emails, you can write up your order, do anything you want to do, have a nap. I see there's some here exactly all the cows. I was going to say all the cows in the can you know stop at the uh Chuck E. Cheese or whatever it is on the way. Um yeah, so we do that, but everywhere else we fly. As we go. I wasn't expecting that answer. And I'm really glad that I got it. That's cre
Unknown dible. I should be one of Uber's best custom
Unknown ers. Yeah, seriously. You've got the like double diamond uh like super secret status that we all we all want. Wow. Like we have this random guy from England Ubers across the state of Texas twice a year. Could you imagine what what would happen if the Uber drivers also knew what was in your luggage? That you just had piles of bespoke shoe samples. Yeah, well
Unknown , do you know what's that it's hilarious? Because sometimes I've gone through airports and as I say, it's it's always interesting ' wecause have quite a few trunks. So we ship a lot. And you'll get a customs officer occasionally or open it and he'll see who it's for, like the name or something. And it totally then diverts his attention. He's like, Oh my god, that's so cool. That you making a shoe for that guy? You know, it's like it it's really then quite a different experience and you're like, Oh that's pretty good. He's like
Unknown , Yeah, have a great day, buddy. And then get through. I also feel like in Texas that's the one place where you can carry shoe leathers because they all get their custom made cowboy boots on. Oh that's true, yeah. So like if if you're gonna carry around a bunch of leathers, including alligator skin, I imagine that's a pretty good one. Yeah
Unknown . Yeah, exactly. And and I feel like everyone I I meet there wears either cowboy boots or I've had cowboy boots made.. Yeah So the actual whole idea or concept of bespoke is pretty well received. And particularly amongst younger guys. Yeah, that makes sense. Which you know I was seeing a big change in now
Unknown . Yeah, that's great. Yeah. So have you have you done these tours for a long time? I mean, I know you visited New York and LA for for a while, but is is the that many markets being interested? Is that something new? No. I mean, we've been doing the trunk
Unknown show tours for about 40 years. Okay. So my dad has been doing it over 40 years. I started doing it um about sort of 12 years ago. But I was doing it probably 10 years before that, you know, meeting my dad in New York and LA and places before I moved there for a while and uh yeah and sort of just organically sort of got introduced to it I guess you could say um but it's been going for you know particularly the cities like New York San Francisco LA um Philadelphia and a few of those have been going, I'd say forty years. We've added cities like Atlanta, but I mean, you know, when I say add, I mean still for at least ten years. You know, so it's quite a long time. And there's a lot of demand in these cities. And I think it's back to whole, you know, 'cause Instagram and you know, all these websites and the access to information now um probably almost helped like you and I first met when you we started that watch uh the strap watch strap collaboration. Yeah yeah right that was what ten, eleven years ago. Yeah it was it was literally when you nine years ago. Seven or eight years ago. Yeah, okay. So so it's quite so you know, people are uh are finding information out there on all these products a lot earlier than they would have done, sort of before the internet. So people are, you know, CM Bespoke, CN Shoes, CM B and then they're actually accessing their website and saying, oh look, they go to this city. Oh wow, they come to Atlanta, or they come to you know, certain cities like Austin and they, you know, which ten years ago we didn't do. Now we're doing all these cities and they're actually as busy, if not busier, than some of the cities like New York. You know, New York's always going to be, you know, a great, you know, because there's a lot of people here that, you know, plus we built up a clientele over 40 years, so you're always going to have a good business here. But people that are in these other states didn't have access maybe to bespoke clothing and especially bespoke shoes from England are now like, wow, these guys come twice a year to my own state and I can come in like an aura as if I lived in London. So which is quite nice. Ye
Unknown ah.. That's amazing That's great. Can you maybe walk people through what you do at Cleverly? For some people who might not know, I realize we're kind of talking about it as if we all know what's going on. But like bespoke shoes is is a kind of esoteric thing, I think, for some people. Yeah, well, uh I'm not quite sure how to do either actually
Unknown . No, but on a serious note, I mean that's what something's quite unique about our company is no one really has specific roles in the sense that you know some days we can be meeting with clients, you know, some days we can be doing trunk shows, some days we can be in the workshop, some days we could be out buying leathers. You know, it's really quite an amazing business from that standpoint because every day I wake up and I've got something completely different. And I could be in a different city, I could be doing and I I'm sort of, I don't want to say not a control freak, but I kind of like to know all aspects of the business. So if I'm going, if I go downstairs into the basement where all our packing department is, and I see a pair of shoes for a customer, I'll pack them. You know, I'll see you. I remember that guy and I'll just jot a little note inside it for him and pop it in the box. You know, if I'm out of the factory, I'll be buying leathers, you know, I love developing colours, patinas. I like bringing something unique to to my clients and the only way to do that really is to a hit set but is to do it yourself. Because then you know you meet your customer, you know what he's looking for, you go to the tannery, you know what to develop because the people that are sort of making all these unique skins, they not necessarily know what your customers looking for, whereas on and there's no shortcut, so every day is very different at Cleverleys for me. And it's the same with my dad. You know, he'll be doing one thing, one moment, and and the same with our shoemakers. You know, you've got Adam who is our workshop director. One minute he's might be in there cutting a pair of shoes. The next minute he's on a plane travelling to do a trunk show. Or he could be seeing a customer in the shop, or we could be doing an event with a with with a gallery or something. I mean, it really is there's no two days the same, which I think is what really makes it so interesting for me, because I don't feel like I actually work, if that makes sense, because when you'd wake up, you know, and and we've spoken about this before but when you wake up and you enjoy what you do you don't then have that Sunday blues or or you know that to on a Sunday and we've all been there you know on the Sunday like oh god I've got to go this on Monday and see I actually generally look forward to it and most people that are coming in buying bespoke shoes or ready-made shoes or I've met them up come and said hey I've got a pair of shoes of Mr. Porter, I'd love to get a pair of bespoke ones or I'd like to do this. You know, it's generally people that are quite enthusiastic and they're there, you're not really selling, they're there because they they want to buy something. Yeah. And they want to order something. So it's it's it's not you're not sort of pitching because they make appointments. It's a totally different personal relationship than from just standing in a shop. Yeah. You don't have to convince them. They seek you out for your product because they're interested in the show. I mean they seek you out, they know that you're the you know, I don't want to say but the best of what you do or you know, and they come to you and they find the whole you know, the whole experience from start to finish really enjoyable because almost to what you guys do, anyone that sort of goes onto your website or your blog or listens to your podcast, it feels like they do feel like they're part of something. And it's the same with George Cleverly. Unlike any of our competitors, and it's not me sitting there saying, Oh, we're the best, but you know, it feels like a club. And that's the atmosphere that we try and create that you're not just another customer, you're not just someone coming in ordering a pair of shoes, you know, you're gonna come in, you're gonna meet the shoemakers, you're gonna meet me, you're gonna meet my dad, you're gonna meet all the pro you're gonna see all the product, you're gonna see us on a regular basis, whether it be in this city or another city. And I think that makes the experience really back to the word bespoke, because that's really how it should be. Um so yeah. That's sort of uh God sounds lovely. Maybe I should get a pair of shoes
Unknown . It's it's a totally unreal experience. And I mean it's it's something that's substantively different, I think, than getting a a suit made, for instance. And I think, you know, we've seen a kind of explosion in the number of, you know, maybe more entry-priced options for for made to measure or bespoke suit options. So I think a lot more young men specifically have experienced having a c a custom suit or a custom jacket or a pair of trousers made, but bespoke shoes are still something super rare and super elevated. I mean, even a lot of guys who who have been having suits made for twenty, thirty years at the best tailors have never bought a pair of bespoke shoes. Yeah. Well and also
Unknown here's the thing, you know, for bespoke shoes, and people say how many competitors do you have and so we really don't have many competitors 'cause actually to make a fully bespoke shoe is so difficult and there are hardly any craftsmen in in the business really. So I m know most of them and it's not like you know like you said about the tailoring and the made to measure there's so many different variations out there of of of suit options that you could say oh I'm I live in you know Texas, I live in you know uh Hawaii or or Florida and everyone has a local tailor, you know, or a local shirt maker, like oh I've got this guy that does this. But if you talk about genuine fully bespoke handmade shoes, and I mean not just from England, I mean anywhere, there isn't that many. And there's only a few in each, I mean, really generally making a fully bespoke shoe where the start to finish is all done by hand. That is, you know, a rarity. And therefore, and it's very specialized. So the people that get into it, um, and it's quite iconic because, you know, shoes are sold in pairs, but all the years we've ever been measuring customers, we've never seen a pair of feet. And a lot of people don't actually think about that. And you like see the measurements, you're like, you're actually half a si it's actually common to be half a size difference. But yet you s but everyone buys shoes in pairs. You're a seven or an eight or an eight and a half, whatever it is. So that's why you've always got a shoe that's either a bit tight or a bit big or what have you. Um but you know it is it is a rarity
Unknown . Yeah. That's really interesting. I mean, how how have you seen the business change maybe over the last like 10 or 15 years? As, you know, you already mentioned Instagram and as kind of the like hashtag menswear world has uh exploded. Have have you seen kind of like the demands your customers are putting on you or the sorts of questions they're asking? Have you seen that change? Or even maybe the types of shoes they're ordering change
Unknown ? Well, it there's been a bunch of changes. I mean I'd say the first change is the age group. When I first got into this business, it was definitely an older customer. And when I say older, I'm probably um, you know, around the sixties. That was two reasons. One is 'cause of the price point. It's expensive. So it took a while for you know for people to get into the position to be able to, you know, buy a pair of handmade shoes or fully bespoke shoes. And the second was the access to the information to even know they existed. 'Cause I've got clients of mine, you know, I remember you know a few years back I I was coming down to the West Village um to measure Arod for a pair for a pair of shoes. And you know, he found the whole process, you know, mind-blown really. He was like, this is amazing. And the amount of people, and he was like, I didn't even know that this sort of thing existed. And he showed me a handmade shoe and I was like that's not a handmade shoe it says it's handmade shoe but it's a handmade shoe it's it's not completely hand stitched that's a machine stitched soul but that's where the term gets thrown around a lot handmade and then you get s you you see it and then he was like, wow, didn't even know this whole thing existed. And that's what I see the big change is people are coming in and when they're seeing the whole process and they see the workshop above our store in London, or they come into a trunk show and they see all these fittings with shoes with no soles on. I think they've that it's like a new world that they've sort of explored. And I and as I say, the age now's drastically dropped. I mean, I would say the average age of guys coming in to see us is in their forties. That is a big drop from, you know, sixties within ten years. And that's a combination of reasons. Again, access to the information. So they're like, you know what, I want to treat myself to a really nice pair of shoes. Um, you know, even if it's one pair. So we you you might have you know a guy coming in as the CEO of a major bank or a corporation, followed by, you know, a school teacher that wants a nice pair of shoes that's saved up and says, you know what, I want to buy one pair a year or one one pair every few years, and these are going to last me 30, 40 years, which they do do. So that's so that's a difference in the customer. Um and then in terms of you know what they're looking for, I guess they're looking for things that are more unique. You know, the the day of selling just a black Oxford, which is traditionally what English shoes are sort of built after. Oxford's not brogues like Kingsman, right? You know, it's uh that day is is not sale. People will still buy Oxfords and derbies and things like that, but they want something a bit more unique. They want something with the unique material or an unique pattern on it. They want something that's a bit more individual to them uh as a person and not something that's run-of-the-ill where you'd walk in, you'd be like, Oh yeah, I could get that shoe anywhere. They want something where someone says, Oh, where'd you get that? I've never seen that from. Yeah. So um so that's probably how it's changed the
Unknown most. You know, you're in kind of a unique position too, because you didn't just enter the business already as a professional. You kind of grew up in the business, right? Yeah, well I this is the ir
Unknown onic thing. So I grew up in the business, you know, Saturday jobs, you know, summer intern, all that type of stuff and I had all the grunt work, George, go pack this, go make the tea, all that type of good stuff. And uh and then sort of, you know, I went to school for economics. I went to University of London for economics and politics, which not many people know, and I went into the whole banking thing for a short while. And it was around the same time Ben actually was in it. And uh I sort of just you know it all sounded quite glamorous. You know, everyone got paid well, they all look really good, all in suits, everyone's out hustling. I thought it's amazing. And I ended up getting a job at a company in New York, but I ultimately wanted to be in LA. That was the sort of place I wanted to be because it was so different from London. So I managed to get a transfer very quick um from New York out to LA and then it was it was for a short while it was really you know, it was super fun. I I sort of was out in Vegas, you know, do doing construction deals of with the team and it was really quite interesting. And then after about, I guess two years, two and a half years, you know, you had that Sunday blues where you were like, you know, getting ready in the morning, you know, oh God, I've got the whole week of this. And you and I knew at that time it wasn't where my heart lied. And then, you know, everything else aside, it wasn't something I generally enjoyed, whereas I would use my vacation at the bank to go and do trunk shows. And that was when I was like, I'm doing something wrong here. Yeah, I'm like in Texas. I'm going to Dallas. You know, it's a new market. And uh and I was like, this is crazy. You know, I'm using my 10 days or two weeks. You get a lot less in America than you can get. Yeah, yeah. It's about it's about two weeks. Yeah, it's about too much generous. And you tell them you're like, by the way, I'm going away for two and a half weeks. Two and a half weeks. And you're like, oh sorry, I'm going on a four and a half. You're using your vacation days. Yeah, they're like, don't want to be paid out for it. I'm like, no, I want to go on vacation. Ye Youah know., but I would take it to go do trunk shows. And you know, and then you know, sort of as you get into it more, just the people you would meet were incredible, you know, and the places you'd end up. Um I mean and I have so many stories in nearly every city that is just surreal. You know, it really is quite you wouldn't believe that you're in those positions and you're like, this is amazing and you'd have so much fun and then towards like the end of it, you'd be like, oh I'm going back to work now. So the other work. And you're like, this is not good. No. And um That's how you know you need a change. Yeah, and then and and then it was back to the whole thing, can you do bespoke shoes in Los Angeles? Which is where I spent a big bunch of my life. And if you know a lot about sort of you know bespoke clothing in London the hub of it is New York in terms of clientele everyone would go let's go to New York let's go to New York you know a lot of you know sort of shirt makers and shoemakers would all set up in New York that was the first place that everyone always came. And it never it always used to blow my mind 'cause I said, you know, LA is full of people that are stylish. LA is full of people that like nice, you know, quality luxury goods. Why does no one go out to Los Angeles? Maybe it's a suit thing because of the climate, but I was like, it's got nothing to do with the shoes. You know, you can wear chuck of boots, you can wear loafers, all that type of great stuff. So we set up an office out there and and sort of continued and that and it really just was amazing what we were able to achieve in a market where sort of I don't want to say everyone left, but no one like n none of our competitors had stores there. Yeah. And if they did, it was a small one out in South Coast Plaza. No one was in Beverly Hills. And I thought this is amazing because, you know, all the other brands are here, all the other sort of major luxury jewelry brands, watch brands, you know, everyone's but there's no real high-end luxury shoemaker. So we sort of went in there and then we have a close relationship with Hollywood, as you know, both on the customer side and the film side, and it's sort of just organically grew from there. And being based there made it so much more obviously accessible. So you know, the requests you would get were crazy. You know, you'd just suddenly be called by someone, oh, can you come over to my house and meet like, you know, and you'd be sitting in their living room you're like this is crazy and and and yeah and then they would introduce you because it's very word of mouth business and then you know the business sort of organically grew from there so I stayed in Los Angeles and I stayed there for uh well I was there totally eleven years. And that yeah and, then I decided to move back to London about a year and a half ago, two years ago, um, 'cause I got married. And uh yeah, and so the rest is sort of history, but we still go out there, you know, all the time. It's funny how life, you know, you end up in certain places and you meet people and uh you know, I have to say, you know, LA was an amazing time. Yeah. And it was n but it's an amazing city as well for for for clientele and people that generally appreciate handmade but spoke. Same with the watches. You know, you you'd spend time there and you'd see you'd meet these amazing collectors and I think you'd like does anyone know about this? You know, it's the West Coast is something I don't know why, but it's like, oh they're out on the West Coast and like, yeah, but it's amazing, you know, and the weather's awesome. I love LA. We haven't talked about
Unknown this in what, like two or three hours. Yeah. Yeah. But if you think about it, LA is the same in my mind, it's the same distance from New York to LA that it is from New York to London. It's just a roughly the same flight. I mean, LA flight. It's four and a half four and a half hours, five, and on a good day to London, it's like five and a half hours. Yeah, that's correct. So it is kind of foreign. It is really far. So it is a place that you kind of forget about, and then you go out there and you're like, this is a wonderful place. And every everyone's nice. Car has a giant smile on her face right now. And everyone's happy, sort of, except for the traffic. But it's just I could see a Hudinki office opening soon. Same.ah, ye Yeah, same. Yeah. Guess who would guess who would run? Interesting
Unknown . Yeah, that's good. Yeah, I mean you you you mentioned watches and you know I know you are a watch guy. How did you get into watches
Unknown ? Do you know what it's funny? Because you know, pe you know, people always say about being a watch collector and what have you. And uh up until you know maybe even a year or so ago, I I didn't even really associate myself as a collector. And the reason being is because, you know, you think of a watch collector and you think of you know, you see these the videos and and and stories here that be guys have got a hundred watches. And I always you think, well that's definitely not me, 'cause I don't have a hundred watches, but uh or a big collection of one particular brand. And the more people I started to meet when I got more involved in this was interesting because you'd get guys that might have a small collection of amigas, but he was a collector. And each one was a collection, not just because of just purely because of the value, because there was a story behind each one. And that's always how I've been. I've never, you know, when I've looked at a watch, I've never purchased um a watch based on its value or how much I'm gonna make for it because I've never sold a watch. And I find that interesting because, you know, a lot of people get watches and they put them in safes and they store them and they're you know, you see them advertised as box fresh. I wear my watches all the time and I wear them everywhere. You know, and even you know my wife will be like i she'll be like oh take a few links out of this and we wear this or something I'm like no no no you can wear links. Because I know once the links come out they'll never get put back in. So that's the biggest battle I have. Yeah, so I always have to, you know, have that issue with it. But you know, that and that's how sort of how I got so each, you know, watch I've got, and I've not loads, but I've got some decent watches. For me, each has a bit of a story behind it. And each one um means a lot to me to the point where I wouldn't part with it. Unless my circumstances change or something happened, I had to sell something but I wouldn't sell it. And that's why people say, you know, I've I've been quite fortunate that I've got some watches that have gone up in value and you know, I always say you know it's like a house it doesn't matter how much they're worth it if you're not if you're not selling it what does it matter really it's nice to know it's a good comfort level yeah but I've never been a collector that's bought something based on how much yeah that I could sell it for down the road. Um and, you know, I sort of, I guess my first Well, I had a bit of a bad experience because the first couple of watches that I expense watches that I I got was I got a tag and and that got stolen. And it was it was a bit brutal because it was one of those you know when you have a house party back in the day, it was my fault to an extent I shouldn't have left it on the side in the bedroom. Someone obviously went anyway. Long story short, the watch disappeared. And I was sort of a bit heartbroken by that. And I was like, I can't believe someone took the watch. I was like, it was really frustrating. And then for a while I didn't know watch. I just because I just was so destroyed. Yeah, you couldn't bring yourself to replace it. Yeah, as and that's I think that's it as well, 'cause you you feel like you've lost an old friend. Right. Right. Yeah. You know, and it was so um it was so sort of and it wasn't at the time, you know, insurance. I didn't insure it, it was all these little things. And it was a big, you know, for me at the time it was a big pill to swallow and I thought God you know I'm not gonna buy another watch for a while until I find something that you know I really really want and then I went through a bit of a dodgy phase I would call it I wanted explain? Well I got yeah okay. So I was into this whole do you remember when um uh what was the watch brand that had all the diamonds on it? Um that you don't see much anymore? It was uh Is it uh Frank Bueller? No, no, no, it was um Mark Jacobs. No, uh not Mark Jacobs, or um Jacobs and Co. Oh. Oh, Jacob and Co. Still around no around. But do you remember there was that era where everyone I didn't but do you remember there was that era of everyone getting diamonds and things like that. Yeah no so I didn't that guy I couldn't afford that watch and I was that that would be a great twist to this story. Yeah imagine that was me in the nightclub with the with the diamonds. You're like and then I replaced my tag with a Jacob and cooking. Yeah, and I had to have something that spoke to me. And uh and I round the corner from us um is uh in Bond Street is Bulgari. Yeah. And Nicola Bulgari is a good client of ours. And he's a lovely guy, and I sort of told him the story of of of um you know the tag and what have you. He said, Oh you should come in, see some of our watches. And uh so time went by and it was close to Christmas, so I I ended up going in there and he very kindly set me up with a couple of the guys in there and I sort of looked all around and and and I saw this rectangular watch which has got the long face and um and I ended up getting that but it had diamonds down the side which I know when I'm saying this I'm gonna regret saying it. And then I was on the side and I thought, you know, oh this is so cool because it's still quite elegant. It had you know staying steel brazen and it still looked really good, but it had the diamonds on the side. So I felt really, really, really cool. Which obviously I wasn't and it's not. Well diamonds are back, so do you still have the watch? Well my wife has it now. Okay. Which by the way is is really probably the right wrist it should have been on. It's okay. It looked a little on the feminine side. And uh but yeah, so that's all so I jumped from one to another. So we'
Unknown ll go through phases. Yeah, of course. I mean I respect it though. I feel like you bought what your heart wanted. And that's really what this is all about. Ye
Unknown ah. And what and you m you know when you get something and I remember I would only wear it once in a while. You know, that's when you really treasure something. Can't run the risk of scratching it. Yeah. Right? So it'd be like a special dinner and you'd be out and you'd just, you know, even you'd be nervous to put your hand on the table. You know, in right place, you I don't want to scratch the bracelet. And then your friends were like, what's wrong with you? Yeah, and you have a problem. Yeah. And you're like, uh you see the new one. And you'd come home yeah and you'd come home and you'd the suit, everything would be thrown, but you'd have time to put the the watch back in the box, close it up, give it a little polish, and put it back in the drawer. So you know it still meant it meant a lot to me, actually watch. It still does, in the sense that my wife's got it. But uh yeah, that was the sort of jump that I made, which was weird phase, weird jump. So you went from tag to the bulgary. Yes. And then what was after that? So after that was um and actually Ben has got a little something to do with this because when I was chatting with Ben and getting a really nice watch, probably about as I say about ten years ago when he first started. He came to London actually and we were just chatting about watches and and and he showed me some of his ones and I was always into Patek Valip. It's always been um a brand that I just think is yeah, I just love the story behind it, I love the family behind it, you know, the designs, everything about it I just really like. But it was, you know, sort of out of my price point at the time when I was looking, I thought that was a bit of a jump to go sort of in that direction. And so I looked at them for a while and I thought, no, it's just too much. You know, I think I'm gonna steer clear of that. So I ended up getting a Santos, RTO Santos. Yeah. Which is a great one. And my one I I got had, it was the Millennium Edition, which not maybe was and it actually had it the gold dial as well. The the numerals. No, no, no, it was all it was all yellow, but it had the um the numerals are in gold as well. Oh and it they called it the millennium edition. And I wanna say that they made two thousand, but don't quote me on that. 2000 and 2000. So yeah, so anyway, so I got that watch and uh and that was just you know that was never come off my wrist. Yeah, you know, I slept that thing on and it was just amazing. Um and then from there um I then which that's why I got more into Patek actually because of Ben so it that's towards yet the back part of it so I should have shouldn't start with that and um and and again then Pat uh Patek Felipe was like, I really want to get one of these watches. And again, I guess because of the profession I'm in, I would see a lot of clients, bespoke clients, who I think are very stylish, and I was looking at the wrists, I get to see a lot of really amazing watches every day. Yeah. And I was always like, you know, I don't want to say coolest guys, but you know, some of the guys that came into the suite and were ordering shoes and this really looked like the part and I was like, what's he got on his wrist? You know, and more often than not, at the time it was either a patek or a daytona or something along those lines. So I was like, I've got to get involved in this. And I ended up getting um a world time. Oh no wow. Which I still have, which I thought actually appealed to me because it's got all you know all those cities surroughout and it sounded quite good. I thought you know when I go for each city I can change it, da da da which I actually never ended up doing. I just changed the time. But um I don't know why. And uh but yeah, so that was my my first sort of and it had so much going on in the face, which is what I really, really at the time loved. Um and and because of my travel schedule, as I say, it was it just sort of made sense. And then it sort of as I started to get more into watches, I then sort of, I guess, went from an overly busy watch with a lot going on um to to sort of scaling back and and and looking for something that was a bit more classic bit more plain um and I can't remember which order I got them in then. I' gotve a couple of other ones I. got uh the Daytona with a black ceramic dar and the white face, and I'd say that's probably one of my favourite watches. I think it's aesthetically beautiful. You know, there's something about Rolex, it's just it's it's just they're made to be worn. You know, they really are. I mean you could put miles on those things and they just they seem as strong as anything. And you know, it just you you literally can I don't use the word beat them up, but you can take them swimming, you can do you do everything, you know, you can use them in the gym and it and you get look at it the next day and it's in pristine order. And you always think that's so I got that, um, and then I got a um Nautilus 5711, which was sort of like the holy grail. Yeah. That's what you're wearing for. The paddock version of the Santos. Yeah. If you really think about it. Yeah, 100%. And you know, I like the idea of clean face. I think it looks like a piece of jewelry as well. I've never been a jewelry guy with like loads of bits and bubs on. That's why I always thought actually getting married I wasn't gonna be able to wear the ring, which you know that that was non-negotiable. You better figure out a way to wear a ring. I was like, I've never worn rings.
Unknown I'm the same way. I was like, I have to wear something now every day
Unknown . Well I won't wear mine. Okay, fine. You know. Um so uh so yeah, so and then it sort of, you know, and the brand's grown on me quite a lot. And I think I've got an interesting story, you know, with uh I got
Unknown this. Yeah, we should talk about this. Yeah, so uh I'll I'll kind of break the uh the secret, but uh George did a city guide for us for the upcoming volume four of the Hodinki magazine. So we're gonna get an insight into your your London. But yeah, you can tell let's let's tell this story. We'll we'll uh give people a little a little teaser.
Unknown So okay. So this is probably going now back um three and a half years or so, and obviously the Nautilus is fifth seven eleven's, you know, it's iconic, it's extremely difficult to get hold of and what have you. But around the corner from my shop is a store called Boodles, um, which is great family-run business, similar to mine. All the directors you know wear my shoes, they're lovely guys. I've known a long time. And they have this thing upstairs called the apartment. And it it's it's as I say, it's as I say family owned but you know they do bespoke pieces so when I wanted to get my engagement ring you know I I worked very closely with a gentleman over there and we we sort of come up with these designs anyway so we come up with a design that I loved and then I wanted to show it to a friend of mine so, I took Jason Statham in there. Uh so he came out of the shop so I said when you're in London, you know, I want I want your opinion on this watch, come over uh for this ring, come over and we'll go and have a look at it. So he said, okay, okay. So we come over, we had some lunch and then we s we we strolled in there after a you know a couple of wines or a couple of bottles of wine, shall I say? Never, never a good idea. And always a great idea. Dangerous combination. You just gotta leave your wallet at home because you can get into serious financial trouble in that place. And uh so we got to the apartment and it's it's really like a living room. It's crazy. So we're sitting there and we're looking at this ring and we're going through it's like it's great, the cut's good. You know, I wouldn't say I'm an expert in rings. I know I've learned quite a lot because of that, you know, and I wanted to get the right one, but it's like I said it's bit bit pricey, bit more than I wanted to spend. And he's like, yeah, go for it. You should buy it. You know, I was like, yeah, see if you say and he's like, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Those are the friends you want. Yeah he's like, yeah, just buy it, don't worry about it. Don't you find it? Yeah, right. If you're so keen, you buy it. You know. And uh and then we started to get on to talking about watches. So they have a great relationship with Patek and they do they deal with um uh they they have quite a few shops throughout the UK. And uh so we started getting on and actually looking through some old Patek books of of different watches and serial rumors and all this sort of stuff. And it got onto about the Nautilus. And it's a watch that I'd been speaking to him about getting for me. Jason wanted one as well. He wanted the 40th year anniversary. It was like chit-chat and chit chat. And uh he said, Well let me see what I can do for you guys. So the guy he speaks one of the directors, we spend an hour talking about watches, bearing in mind the ring now's on the other side of the room, sitting above a fireplace, just in this box, not gone how it and you know, after a few drinks you're forget all about the ring. And we end up getting these two watches, which is this one, and then he got his one and we walk we we walk this is not yeah we walk out of the store and we go back round to my store you know super happy with the purchases and what have you and it was only when I got like close to my shop I thought oh shit fuck I didn't even buy that ring you know that was what we went in there for and I
Unknown was like I felt so anyway so I couldn't I at the time I was like you know