Q&A And A New Seiko Chronograph With Blake Buettner And James Stacey¶
Published on Thu, 25 Jul 2024 16:55:00 +0000
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Synopsis¶
In this episode of Hodinkee Radio, host Tony Traina welcomes back Blake Buettner, a watch media veteran who first contributed to Hodinkee in 2010. Blake has since worked with StockX and served as managing editor of Worn & Wound before launching his own project, The Deep Track. The conversation begins with the trio discussing their most-worn watches of 2024, with Blake highlighting an unexpected favorite: a mid-2000s Rolex Sea-Dweller reference 16600 that he acquired through a trade.
The discussion then shifts to the microbrand watch space, with insights from the recent Wind Up Watch Fair in Chicago. The hosts explore the evolution of smaller watch brands, praising companies like Formex, Christopher Ward, Laurier, and Anordain for their creativity and innovation. They discuss how these brands are democratizing exotic materials and bringing unique design perspectives to the market, with James ultimately purchasing an Autodroma Group C digital watch at the show.
A significant portion of the episode focuses on Blake's journey in watch media, from his early days writing for Hodinkee after being introduced by Jeff Quo of Zetem watches, through his first trips to Switzerland, to covering Basel World. Blake and James reminisce about their first meeting in Austin in 2013 for Formula One with Armin Strom, reflecting on how the watch media landscape has transformed over the past decade—from a niche, nerdy hobby to a fully commercialized industry driven by Instagram and hype culture.
The episode concludes with listener Q&A, including discussions about the new Seiko Prospex Speed Timer in the "Pogue" colorway, thoughts on Vacheron Constantin and the Overseas collection, and why there are so few small, slim, hand-wound dress watches on the market today. Blake introduces his new venture, The Deep Track, which features a weekly podcast interviewing industry figures and collectors, along with editorial content exploring interesting and accessible vintage tool watches from the 1990s and early 2000s.
Links¶
Transcript¶
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| Tony Traina | This episode is brought to you by Hodinki Insurance. Collecting watches is fun. Insuring watches is not. But with Hodinki Insurance, we've teamed up with Chubb, the premier insurer of valuable collections, to offer a better and more seamless experience to ensure your watches and even jewelry. Minimizing the paperwork and maximizing the protection so you can stop worrying about your watches and focus on enjoying them. Hodinki Insurance, protect what you love. Visit insurance.hodiniki.com for more details. Ladies and gentlemen, welcome back to another episode of Hodinky Radio. I am Tony Traina, your host. Today our guest is Blake Bettner Watch media, having first contributed to Hodin Key way back in 2010. Since then, he went on to work with StockX before becoming the managing editor of Warn |
| James Stacy | ? Uh what's up everybody? Doing really well. Good uh Thursday morning to you both and uh always pumped to sit down with uh with two of my buddies. Uh it's funny, Tony, a more recent bunny, and Blake, about as long a buddy in this industry as I've got. So this will be really fun. Abs |
| Tony Traina | olutely. We're gonna get into that in just a minute. Blake, I wanted to start here though, because on last week's episode we did a bit of a half year recap basically. I had James and Mark on and myself, and one of the things we talked about that I thought would be a fun way to kick it off with you is the watch we've worn the most so far this year, something we always do at the end of the year with Hodinky. Thought we'd do a little mid-year 2024 check-in. So give it to us, Blake. What's the watch you've been rocking the most this year? |
| Blake Buettner | So I gotta say, it's an unexpected watch. I brought it in as a part of a uh camera watch trade deal, and it's a reference 16600 C Dweller from the early 2000s, and it belonged to a photographer. It is a very crisp case, all the kind of stuff that you would look for. Um, I've never owned a sea dweller before. I didn't know if I'd really fancied myself as a sea dweller guy. Uh, but I gotta tell you, I've had this on almost non-stop since I picked it up. Um, I usually have like an FXG or something like that on my wrist, but uh but something about this has uh has really connected with me. So I've been wearing this predominantly since I picked it up earlier in the year. So I think it's this |
| Tony Traina | uh it's this old sea dweller. Give me a little bit of uh about the wearing experience compared to say the FXD that you mentioned, you know, mid-2000s Rolex versus a modern tutor. What's the what's the appeal there for you? I mean, obviously, like, |
| Blake Buettner | you know, nine out of ten people will mistake it for a submariner or something like that. Um, but it feels a bit different and it wears a little bit different as well. The case is definitely more substantial. Obviously, this is a 4,000-foot uh depth resistance and it's got the um you know the helium release valve on the side of the case and all that kind of stuff so all the history's there all the little Easter eggs are there um but it wears just that much more uh substantially interesting, I don't know, something like that on the wrist compared to a 14060. Uh which is a watch that I also really enjoy. Uh this wears a bit smaller than something like the FXD though. Um and it's got that kind of like uh just old school enough uh kind of Rolex uh tool watch look. Um that you know, I there's something about this watch and this look that I think um that works really well. So, you know, the FXD I think it's it's a little bit bigger. Um this uh Sea Dweller, I feel like, is a much better like t-shirt and jeans type of companion for kicking around or going out into the city, dock jumping off of uh uh these Wisconsin docks and stuff like that. It's it's kind of a great all-around watch uh it compared to the fxd which I would say is maybe a little more kind of like low-key toolish uh than this watch. So it's hard to describe but it's something you gotta spend time with both of these watches uh to really kind of appreciate their differences. But I've I really really try |
| Tony Traina | Well, calling in from Wisconsin in sunglasses, a T-shirt, a nice sunny backyard, I think the C Dweller fits right in, my friend. I think it's well chosen today of all days. Exactly. Yeah. Guys, before we get into your background a little bit, Blake, I think I wanted to talk a little bit. James and I were hanging out all this past weekend, if you can believe it, at the the wind up watch fair here in Chicago. And Blake, since you spent a few years with Warren and Wound as well, know the micro brand space pretty well. I thought it'd be a good time for us to do just a bit of a a bit of a micro brand update. What's happening in the space, maybe stuff we saw in Chicago, but but more broadly than that too, guys. So James, uh maybe we can just talk about that first. You know, there weren't a ton of net new watches, I would say, at at Warren and Wound at the Wind Up Watch Fair this year, which is fine, but it was my first time seeing a lot of things in person that I'd seen released over the course of 2024 and even late 2023. I could list off a few of them now. One of them on your wrist even I think that's probably a year or two old at this point. But I'm curious if I'm curious if you could maybe start and then Blake and I will kick it around from there. Some of the exciting stuff that you saw from from the wind up watch fair or from just the micro brands in general that that tend to present at a at a show like that |
| James Stacy | ? Yeah. three wind up shows. It's right on the cusp of like Switzerland shutting down for a month ish or more. I mean, anybody who's sending emails to folks at Swiss outlets right now are getting some uh bounce backs on those emails. So it's you know it's already begun. Uh so I think it's it's I think that helps define the kind of experience of the Chicago show because it's very chill, it's pretty relaxed, it's very uh welcoming and and straightforward. And as far as like the product goes, I thought there was a ton, man. I saw some some really great stuff from Formax. Uh their reef series continues to be pretty impressive. Uh Christopher Ward, I finally got a chance to like go hands-on with essentially their entire lineup. And I think that new super compressor is a pretty cool, compelling, like fun thing for the money. Uh, on top of that, I saw their carbon Colchester, the C63 Colchester, also pretty nice. Oh, it was really cool to see Marathon there, you know, uh Canadian brand that I'm a big fan of, uh and to see them, you know, they're they're a brand that does a lot of shows, but not necessarily watch shows. And then in the same year to have them at uh Time to Watches in in Geneva and then again at Wind Up, I think is pretty fun. And then you get all of the like the genuinely like little tiny to medium sized small brands. Uh things like an Oak and Oscar had their new chronograph there. Incredible case. We had uh Baltic of course was there and and showing some great stuff, fairer. Uh it I mean if you like your sports watches, you've got everything from a few hundred dollars for like uh something awesome like from Laurier all the way up to uh Oris. So there's there's a lot there and it's also one of the few chances you can get to actually see an Anordain in person, which I think is is worth it all on its own. It's funny. Le |
| Tony Traina | wis was on our podcast a few weeks ago, the founder of Anordain, and was talking to him, but I realized I had not seen the model three in person yet and they had a few of them there. So it was great to finally see that wave pattern dial. I had seen the Hodinki one with kind of the engraved lines that we did with them a year or so while but totally different dial effect. Really, really cool to see in person. Like you've spent a few years really focused on this space as well. Curious from your perspective, what in particular, if anything, is is exciting for you in the space right now. Yeah, I think there's a lot of really |
| Blake Buettner | exciting things happening in that space right now. The brands that James just listed off, I'm hugely fond of. I think there's a really incredible amount of creativity being expressed uh in the micro brand, small independent, whatever you want to call it, uh kind of space. And you know, I I think that um it's it's really causing uh you know I don't want to say disruption, but I think a lot of even bigger mainline, more traditional Swiss brands are like starting to pay closer attention to what some of these brands are doing now. Uh and it's certainly nice if you see some of the uh maybe the call like a doc democratization of some of these quote unquote exotic materials that you had seen used in the traditional brands maybe 10 years ago, kind of come into this space now, and you can get you know Forge Carbon and all titanium watches, all this kind of stuff for very reasonable prices, expressed in really creative ways. So, you know, uh Formex that that James mentioned, I think they're a brand that I've um that that I I've've talked a lot about, the the innovation that they uh that they um are bringing to some of their watches is truly incredible. I mean you think about something like uh the case suspension system that they're using in some of their watches and the you know for,ged carbon cases, it's really remarkable stuff. You know, and they have their own unique individual modern design language, which I really enjoy as well. Yeah, I think the the the microbrand space, um, you you see a lot of really interesting things and creative ideas being expressed. And there's also a lot of um you know leaning into maybe classic, more traditional design things where, you know, we want to create this kind of a look, but make it a little bit more accessible, uh, you know, to like an old 6542 GMT or something like that And I and you know, I I don't begrudge anybody for for doing that. I think there's some really beautiful things going on there. You know, James mentioned Laurier as well. I think they do really remarkable stuff as well. Um, but I I really like the you know, the watch that the James has on his wrist right there. That's like uh you know from Auto Droma. There's some really unique things going on that you just don't see anywhere else. And I I tend to really enjoy some of these brands mostly for their for bringing like really unique individual creative ideas to life in their own way. Uh, you know, Furon Mari, I think, is a great example of this and and uh and their new watch uh that came out this week I think is beautiful the Anne Ordain that you mentioned that's very unique and individually them. You know maybe some of these watches are a little bit outside of like my wheelhouses and the watches that I generally wear, but spending time with them and seeing them is like truly an inspiring thing. Uh and something and that's I love the Chicago wind up because I'm a Midwest guy, obviously. So those are kind of like my people. That's kind of like my feel. So that was always my favorite show of the year. Um, and walking around there and seeing all the people from the Midwest getting the chance for the first time often to see some of these watches is a really special experience |
| Tony Traina | . All right, James, he set it up for you. Uh do you want to tell the people what you decided to buy sort of on the spot at wind up |
| James Stacy | ? Yeah, I mean I can't I can't say that it was fully on the spot. It's a watch that I saw the week that it came out, which I think is nearly two years ago, maybe even a little bit more than two years ago. Um and it's the autodromo group C. I'm a huge acolyte of of like what Bradley gets up to with with that, especially into the group watches. Now there's group B and Group C. I've owned uh two group B's, really great watches. Uh I love Bradley's use of color. I think color is very difficult to incorporate into a watch without it being only about the color. And he's really good at finding ways of leaning on, you know, uh historical uses of colors from cars and racing and that kind of thing. And then he launched this group C, which is literally just a digital watch in a s nice steel case. Um and uh I I absolutely adore quartz. I love digital watches. I think they're a lot of fun. And I I love it a a watch with some automotive charm that doesn't look like a speedo, like a speedometer from a from a car. Uh and I I think he just did a lovely job with this. I got it in if you want to see it on the camera, uh, the yellow Sarah coat, which is uh maybe the least legible as it has a negative L C D, but it is the most fun, which is what I'm going forward. Currently I'm wearing it on a uh purlon, but it comes on quite a nice black rubber stra |
| Tony Traina | p. Yeah, that's great. I think it was the first time I had seen that watch in person actually, two years. Uh it's just not something you see a ton of. The other watch he recently released that was kind of cool to see was this kind of just minimalist he it's an entire sort of concept watch almost I think it's called the racing team. Just a minimal minimal chronograph concave dial completely sort of grayed out. Uh kind of a fun watch to see in person. But yeah, love the aesthetic and everything he's doing there. Not even a car guy, but it speaks to me in some sort of ways. Uh so that's I think we can leave the the wind up and micro brand recap there because Blake, it's the first time you've been on Hodinky in I mean probably going on a decade now, my friend. So I want to dig in a little bit to your background and what you've been up to recently because you were, if not the first, one of the first names to ever appear on hodinky.com besides Ben Klymer. So maybe we could start there and you could just give us a quick sort of story on how you even uh stumbled into watches and then after that I assume Hodinky Yeah. Yeah, I |
| Blake Buettner | was um it's it's it's funny. I was working in San Francisco at the time and uh with a guy that ran a small watch brand that you know in light of the conversation that we just had was probably ten years ahead of his time. His name was Jeff Quo uh and he ran a brand called Zetem. Uh these very interesting watches with no lugs, so the the uh the strap would kind of like incorporate right into the case. Very well thought out designs, and he was a very thoughtful guy. I was working with an ad network, so we were developing solutions for high-end brands to connect with affluent consumers. You know, that kind of thing. And a lot of these people happened to be on sites like Kodinky that uh was relatively new at that point and you know, we were working with some watch brands trying to kind of connect those dots and Jeff being local in uh San Francisco, um, you know, we we hit it off uh um real well because I've always been always been into watches and pocket watches and stuff like that. So he's the one that knew Ben and made the introduction uh there. So um you know he sent uh an email connecting the two of us and said oh this guy's you know he's a real watch nerd and he's pretty good at writing you should you should see what he can can do uh and this was back when um Ariel Adams also lived in San Francisco of a blog to uh read is what it was back then. At the time. Yeah, right. Yeah, at the time. So he and I had had you know connected a few. So I was aware of the this kind of emerging media landscape of of of of watches. But Ben and I hit it off really well. And you know, I think on like a level of of uh of taste and the kind of watches that we both enjoyed we're kind of like on the same page there. So um so it was really, you know, and then it was kind of like off to the races. I think the first thing that I ever wrote about was a panor eye. Uh it was a new panorai watch. So digging into the history there and you know, Ben kind of guiding me along of well, you don't need to say all this and that. You can kind of focus on on here. So he kind of fostered and shepherded uh, you know, my um my writing uh over over the first couple of years and um and I was thrown into the deep end relatively quickly. I think the first trip to Switzerland I made was uh Parmigiani Fourier, into Fleurier, and uh got to to to meet Michelle Parmigiani and tour the museum there, the Sando's collection, all that kind of stuff, and uh and see the manufacturing and get a behind the curtain look at all of this kind of stuff. So, you know, from from then on, it was kind of like a, oh, this is this is awesome. I could do this for for for a living. Uh so from then on, uh, it was really kind of just diving headfirst into it. And then, you know, covering Basel Worlds and then everything that come with that and all the travel around in the industry. Um so and I've been hooked pretty much ever ever since. Uh, you know, and and as much as I enjoy the watches and stuff, I I've made so many great friendships and relationships with the people uh that are also in this industry, as you guys know, it's relatively small world. Um you know, and the people that I met even way back then, I I'm you know, I'm I'm extremely grateful and fortunate to say to you know, to call them friends to this day, uh guys like James and Jason and Eric Wind and and a and a litany of others. Uh so yeah, I I I came for the watches and stayed for the people over over the long haul, I guess you could say. Um but yeah, that that's how I ended up uh at Hodinki |
| Tony Traina | . Any favorite articles or projects you remember sort of working on in those early years? I was gonna ask you about your first ones, but you kind of ran through them there. I mean peak panoride days. I had a question about is it called Zedum, I think you said I had a question because that was one of the first articles you had written. So you already answered that one, but I'm curious if there's any sort of larger projects or articles that that stand out to you as being highlights. Yeah, there's a handful |
| Blake Buettner | of others. I really enjoyed the A Week on the Wrists, like as that was kind of kicking off. Those were kind of my uh I don't know, things I really enjoyed kind of having some time to really dive into something uh and go beyond just the stats sheet and the the press release type stuff. Uh really kind of uh form some some thoughts on on the watches. Um but other than that, there was a brand called DMH, uh which which uh this this this Dutch guy out of his garage making these like jump hour watches out of these old movements um bringing the bringing his story to Hodinky was really incredible. There was also a guy named Bob that had listed an old sub on eBay that had no idea what it was for no reserve, and um you know that that I'd come across somewhere and like the next day the bidding was up to forty, fifty thousand dollars and and this guy had no idea why. I reached out to him and got to talk to him and and interview him and and tell his story on Hodinky and I got to do like a radio interview because the the story kind of went viral for for for its day. That guy and his wife would still share, you know, picture albums of their family throughout the years after like uh it was like a real relationship that developed uh because of that. So um telling stories like that and really discovering people like that is really what cemented my feelings on some of these watches as more than just a status symbol or an auction result or something like that, that they had real kind of interesting stories behind them. Um and then that has been kind of my driving force into, you know, how I've tried to evolve in this space to this da |
| Tony Traina | y. Well you and James both at this point are kind of uh the old guys in the industry, if I may say. Uh at least to some people, uh, you know, you've been at it for quite some time, James as well, you know, more than 10 years. Uh do you guys remember when you first met? |
| James Stacy | I went back to uh double check this because we talked November twenty thirteen, I think. Um was it in was it in Texas? Yeah, it was Austin uh for Formula One with Armin Strong. Yep. Yeah. Do you remember do you remember that trip pretty well? What what team was it? They were was it Roosha Force? Yep, it was Moosha. And uh yeah, |
| Blake Buettner | uh the late Jules Bianchi was uh was the driver who was of course uh uh a Ferrari, if I'm not mistaken, prospect. Uh yeah, who who sadly passed away a year or two later. Um yeah, I I still have all the pictures from that race and the cars look so different now |
| James Stacy | . It's crazy. Oh ye yeah.ah. Yeah It's crazy looking. I mean the track kind of looks different now too, because that was early days for F one in Austin and like the logistics were tough. I remember that being like a very exciting trip because Armin Strom, a tiny brand, yeah were actually just in Austin at a Red Roof Inn with the two owners who are really lovely guys and I've kept in touch with for more than well over you know, a little over a decade now. And they're still making really impressive watches. The product has changed quite a bit but, so is the whole world surrounding that. And and you know, I'm with Formula One where it is now, I don't know that a brand like Armandstrom would get the value. Yeah. Um with for what the number must be to put your name on it. You know, but Braymont was in and out of it with Williams, and we still have IWC with uh Mercedes and and that sort of thing. So it's not unheard of, but it was an insane trip because Austin was just at max capacity. Every restaurant was insane. Every uh you know, the whole race experience was wild. Yeah, this was this |
| Blake Buettner | was only like the second year, I think, that the race was was there. Uh and of course the the Miami race and Vegas race were far from being a s a thing. So so this was like a really novel uh thing. I remember like all the excitement around, oh, what's the Ceph1 stuff? Uh kind of kind of going into it. But the experience itself, yeah, it was was was maybe not like super fancy, but it was a lot of fun because the people were great. Yeah, shout out to Cloud and uh and the guys over there at Armand Strom. Uh that was a really incredible uh experience. And yeah, I remember us like just talking cars. Oh yeah, that's like being there like yeah the the |
| Tony Traina | whole time. So yeah, that was yeah, over over ten years ago now. The way you guys have been talking about well first of all press trips, I suppose, and things like uh going to an F1 event and staying at the the Red Roof Inn, I think is something that would not happen nowadays. But the way you talked about some of the early stories you wrote. And if you look at them, it's a a very different time in watch media and the internet more generally. Blake, I'm wondering if you could just talk a little bit about having been in it for a while, some of the major changes you've sort of observed in your time in uh uh watch media or watch |
| Blake Buettner | It's it's it's crazy. I think the last ten years has has really seen a shift. Um uh you know, I think when when we first started, um and maybe James shares the sentiment or not, uh but it wa it was still kind of like a uh a nerdy thing, a bit of a nerdy thing to be into. Um and it quite hadn't quite hit like this um yeah, like what now we might say like hype culture or or or kind of fashion culture, which now it's very much like in in in in that realm. Um but it w didn't feel like that to me uh at the time like it was really something that you that you could kind of nerd out on. And it was more about kind of like uncovering the history of some of these things. You know, I know Ben was kind of like an early guy that was into the Royal Oak and and discovering that watch and and uh these old submariners, the the his 5512 like seeing those watches and then learning about their history and you design them and then really kind of like going down the rabbit holes on forums like the Vintage Rolex forum to you know understand the dial differences between some of the fifty five twelve references and uh and just how deep that stuff can go. You know, or the bezels and you know, the the the thick numbers on some of them because the pads had worn down, or you know, stuff like that was just kind of like endlessly interesting to me. And it felt like there was an endless source of interesting things to learn about from the communities that were there and celebrating this stuff. Um, you know, but I don't remember things like uh like the Instagram. Like I felt you could be into things for your own reasons a little bit more and less kind of like what's in the current zeitgeist of like what's really cool and who's wearing what and like uh what's retaining its retail value and and stuff. I don't remember that being a part of the conversation back then. Maybe it was in a different way. |
| James Stacy | I don't know. Yeah. Yeah. I think with a certain strata of watches, if you went way back to T Z like early days of Jorn and those guys, those guys were all wondering like was this a good idea? Right? Uh or or you know, the ear early days of of other like hugely now massively influential brands, aims and that sort of thing. Yeah, I mean for me, it feels like the last decade the watch was world quite small and everybody had like a little niche and then all of that was put into like a blender called Instagram and then that blender like went to twenty out of ten due to the pandemic and and now now I think things are just starting to settle. Like I think there's always been sort of like a strata um that kind of stacked on top of itself. It just got sh really shaken up in the last couple years. But I I think that the like there's like huge pluses and minuses to it being less of a walled garden. It's a little bit more open. Information's easier to find. You don't have to be, you know, an accredited, proven member of a certain group in a certain you know, forum to be able to talk or buy or sell a watch or that sort of thing. Yeah. But on the other side, I think that uh some of the like cottage element of the fascination has kind of become fully commercialized, fully uh like, you know, we all used to know guys who would buy and sell a watch here or there, and now some of those guys are like the most prominent vintage dealers in existence. Right. And I think that's some of the difference is the the market expanded and and a lot of it became um work instead of just enthusiasm. That's all I mean I'm projecting a lot because over that decade I also went deeper and deeper and worked more and more. But it does seem like it it started out as something a little bit more cottagey or a little bit more experience-based, a little bit more about, you know, going to a red bar or uh a hangout in your city and seeing a watch you've never seen before and maybe then taking the photos home and putting them into you know a terrible WYSIWYG editor on watch you seek and hoping that the photos the links actually work. It's a whole different thing. Yeah. Um and and it's a lot more about the the the people than it is the watches, it's more about the clout than than this and and then in many cases and I think we've seen this and we've seen a kind of increasing pushback on it. So much of it is about like what the the hype is. So not just the zeitgeist like Blake was saying, but if I can borrow the term, like what's the meta of watches, right? Like w what six things are in right now and everybody wants, but and then what are the six things that people have now decided that they don't want? And I think that was less crucial back in the day. It just wasn't really considered. Yeah, I agree with |
| Blake Buettner | you, James. I think there's only really a couple of things that kind of concerned me on this route. And and the first thing is is the pace at which this industry is starting to move and it feels like it has to keep up with the regular fashion industry, which I don't think is a sustainable or maybe healthy thing. It shouldn't. And and the other is you know, I I talk about the things that we find interesting about some of these old watches, like what will the future generations look back at this era and and think of of us. Like I I don't want it to just be about the auction results or the celebrities sightings or you know it's it's fun of that this some of that stuff is like I feel like that's not what makes the watch interesting ultimately. You know we, got pulled into some of these watches because of the interesting stories associated with them. So yeah, I I'm always encouraged and I know James is the same way, like do more interesting things in your watches. And I think that will foster uh you know a future generation taking the same kinds of interest in this space that James and I have |
| Tony Traina | a lot of Yeah, I've always thought a big auction result or a celebrity wearing a watch can be a nice hook to get someone interested in a watch to say, oh, what's Roger Federer aware and Timothy Chalamet, whatever it is. It's like a piece of data. Yeah. But it shouldn't, it it shouldn't, nor can it be the entire story of why you're into watches because that that's pretty fleeting, right? You need to get into the heritage, the craftsmanship, whatever it is, the the real sort of meat of the matter. And if you can't get people interested in that, they'll kind of just be uh they'll be passers by and then they'll move on to the next thing in six months when they haven't really dug their teeth into to the actual stuff. So that's kind of always been uh where I've where I view it. And that's why you, you know, you'll see us do wash spottings and other stuff on the on the website to to hopefully get people in the door, but it's just that. It's the front door. It's not the uh it's not the living room, you know, this is the living room if you're if you're here, welcome. Uh take a seat. Uh, because we're gonna talk some watches right now, I think, guys. That's a a quick little trip down memory lane, but I wanted to get Blake on just so we could talk a little bit about watches. I think the first thing that we're gonna do, I'm gonna start trying to do this as just an intro to to the weekly podcast that we do is pull a new watch release we've had from the from the from the website, I should say, and just talk about it for a few minutes. Sometimes we do these intros, but we have more thoughts that we want to talk about. And I thought a good one for this week or a good candidate would be the new Seiko prospects speed timer. So this is the one that has I'd call it the pogue colorway. Someone in the comments called it a fogue, which I thought was kind of funny as well. So for those who haven't been paying attention, this is the new Seiko Prospect Speed Timer. This is the new Seiko Ppectros Speed Timer SSC 947. It uses the Seiko Solar Speed Timer Platform, 41mm, but the thing it does is it kind of plays on the Seiko Pogue colorway, if you will. That bright yellow golden dial, and then the Pepsi style bezel that you saw worn in the original 6139 automatic chronograph on Colonel Poe when he went on his NASA Skylab mission in 1973. This is kind of the closest we've seen to Seiko making any direct reference to that. They did it in a time-only Seiko 5 sports watch, but this is the first time we've really seen it in a chronograph. Granted, it's still very different from the 6139. Nor does Seiko make any explicit reference to it, nor should they, I think, in my opinion, it would probably get people even more riled up. But Lake, I I'm sure this is something that that's been on your radar and I'm curious if you have any any sort of thoughts on the new Seiko speed timer Vogue, I think we'll go away. No, I I think you you |
| Blake Buettner | said it exactly right. It the pogue colorway, and that's exactly how I referred to it when I when I talked about the watch. Uh you know, if you're if you're coming looking for a return of a sixty-one thirty-nine, you're not gonna find it here. And to be fair to Seiko, as you mentioned, I don't think they ever referred to it as such. Uh, you know, I think to them this is just kind of a historic colorway that they brought back. And the SSC, the speed timer chronographs already have a blue dial with the kind of uh, you know blue and red bezel, which was also a colorway on the 6139. Uh you know, that came in a few different colorways. I love the the 6139. I've I've had a couple over the years and um it's great. I would love to see a proper kind of return of that style of uh of a chronograph. So, you know, uh I do I begrudge Seiko for bringing this colorway back? Um no, only because, you know, they're not referring to it uh as as anything special as you know uh uh yeah they're not connecting those dots uh personally and it's gotten a lot of people talking about the pogue and the 16139 so my hope is that a lot of people are seeing this and seeing the discussion around it and maybe discovering the 16139 for the first time. And uh and that's like all of a sudden becomes a whole new world for them to really get into and appreciate. Uh I this is this watch as it on its own and in all its different colorways. It's got uh quite a few different colorways if I'm not mistaken. I think they're all really handsome and and sharp. And I, you know, I like their their solar uh chronograph watch. Um yeah, I have no issues with it. Uh I I see it as more as this kind of an awareness uh type situation, I suppose, for for for the colorway itself. But uh yeah, I I would not call this the pogue or the return of the pogue. I think that's where people get into some hot water here |
| James Stacy | . Yeah, yeah, that's good point. Like like Tony outlined in in his story, like Seiko's definitely not calling this the pogue. I do think that it's a really good colorway, and I also think it's a colorway that you could apply to a ton of different watches. Like it doesn't ha I don't think it has to remain on uh chronograph. I mean this chronograph even just as a just the chronograph part is very different than an actual pogue, let alone the shape of it, the case, the sizing, all of these elements. Uh but at seven hundred dollars in a pogue color way. I always try and think like who when when a brand does something that could be even considered ever so slightly controversial or noteworthy or whatever, like who might this offend and who might this align with? And the weird thing is is it's like in my mind it's a Venn diagram that's just one circle of like pogue owners that absolutely don't want a Seiko a solar Seiko chronograph and pogue owners who are like hey red another one of the same color. And it's only seven hundred dollars and and and that sort of thing. And I I think I think that they continue to make pretty compelling watches at a certain price point and bucks for this watch feels like a screaming deal. And if it brings, like Blake said, a little bit of awareness to the history of the pogue, what the pogue was good for, like what it um what it kind of brought to the world and what it means to Seiko's history, very cool. And if this is them testing the water to see to get some audience feedback based on a colorway. Very and very intelligent in my opinion, free feedback, uh which is, you know, not always common. Uh and there's nothing stopping Seiko who can make absolutely everything because they make everything themselves, um, there's nothing stopping them from from doing a proper reissue. Uh, and maybe this is just the first wave of that, or maybe we'll start to see the pogue as like a uh a more common colorway from the brand, which I think could be really cool. It is kind of their weird signature of a you know Pepsi style bezel in that orangey yellowy gold dial. So I'm look, I think this colorway would look rad on a 777 like a prospects I think would look really cool on uh SPB. Uh so I I don't I don't disagree with anybody who's saying okay fine but where's the actual pogue and maybe that's coming in the future or maybe this is uh some s some sort of other strategy, or maybe this was just like we have a chronograph and we have a cool colorway from a chronograph in the past and that was as far as they took it. I don't I think it's pretty successful at seven hundred dollars. Yeah |
| Blake Buettner | . on top of that. Uh I would love to see more simple chronographs that just have a 30 minute counter on them. Or essentially mounted chronographs. Like that's the kind of stuff. Centrally mounted for sure. So cool. |
| James Stacy | Absolutely. Yeah. Give me more. That's that that won't be seven hundred bucks. But I mean unless Seiko makes a cool quartz movement, I can do it. But yeah. What do you like to Tony? I know that you've you've had so you've had a pogue of your own. Maybe maybe he's mentioned that you've had more than one. |
| Tony Traina | No, but you know what's funny is I've been working I have a uh a collector buddy here in Chicago who has four or five six one three nines including one or two pogs they're known uh what what you call them the pogue plug? The pogue plug Yeah. Everyone needs one, my friend. Everyone needs one. And I'd been working on on getting those watches together to to do some photography and a story because I don't have any of my own to photograph. has just to to Blake's original point because kind of renewed the interest in getting that going. But James, you mentioned something there. I'm curious for for your perspective on on this briefly, because last year they did a a limited edition reissue basically of the original Seiko 5, kind of that chunky watch. They even made a different bracelet for it that emulated the original. And then this year they built on it with two more limited editions that came out just in the past few months. They call them their like Seiko 5 Heritage Design or something. Kind of separate from the modern Seiko 5 sports. They use that chunky original 39mm case of the Seiko 5 and play on some of the original colorways and designs. Even use some the original logo sometimes. I'm curious if that's something you'd like to see with the six one three nine or are we just over the whole reissue, you see a sort of one for one reissue |
| James Stacy | uh at this point. Look, I think some brands should be over this. I think a brand like Seiko, which has been making watches in like made watches in that era and has been start and like still finds success, whether it's that 55th anniversary for the the Seiko 5, or if you look like last year we had the relaunch of the Navigator, which is an awesome recreation. Uh I I think the brand would be super smart to follow up, you know, preferably in time for people to buy them for Christmas or whatever with uh with a reissue of the pogue, I'd probably make it a limited edition, but in the Seiko way where it's like forty five hundred for the world. Make it a little bit special. Don't make it impossible to buy, that sort of thing. Um do I think that they need uh sixty one thirty nine or even any of these vintage reissue pieces as like part of their coal lineup? No. But I think they're kind of cool flagships and things that speak to a certain like wing of you people I think I think we also forget, not just people at at large, but us, like just how big Seiko is and how many markets they operate in. And like deep enthusiasm for watches is going to be a sliver of their global market. Deep, deep enthusiasm for Seiko vintage watches is going to be a sliver there in. Make a watch for that sliver, and I think you sell all of them for sure. But um and I and I think that's where some of the it's I don't think anybody's like finding this watch to be controversial. I think it just it's a it's a bit like when when Tudor releases a version of a watch but and you like everything except the color. And you're like, well, but I and this is almost like the inverse of that, where people seem to obviously love the color and it's very famous. Um, but maybe this isn't the the the home Aaron Powell I'm on the same page, and I generally would say |
| Blake Buettner | that I don't think brands should lean too heavily into making these reissues. They're like whole stock and trade. I think that's a risky place to kind of it's it's you can you can kind of back yourself into a corner. That said I think Seiko could absolutely get away with doing something like that just because of the breadth and variety of watches that they do make and how well that they do it. Um you know I think they could take almost like a a zenith type route where they have the kind of like modern references that they're pushing forward. Yeah. And then they also kind of like create and recapture their history like perfectly and they kind of like live side by side with each other. Um so but yeah, I I'm generally I'm I think myself and probably a lot of others are kind of over the just straight up reissue type thing. Um but I I would not hate to see it from Seiko. And I would also love to see them put you know if they wanted to take a stab at well here's if we would have made this watch today, here's what it maybe would look like. And here's conceptually kind of the et |
| Tony Traina | hos of this watch put forth in a modern design. You know, I'd be for that. Yeah, James, as you mentioned, oftentimes these Seiko limited editions are so and name only. That Seiko 5 Sports 55 Anniversary Limited Edition I just mentioned that came out last year was a they call it a controlled production run of 15,555 pieces. Still available on Seikousa.com for you uh a year later. These things take some time to sell out. So uh I think that something like that would be would be totally feasible. But guys, we are going to leave the Seiko discussion there for the day and we're gonna move on to a few actual listener QA questions to close out the show. Uh, we did a QA a couple of months ago, got to a small fraction of the questions, so we're gonna do a few more. And the first one, guys, comes from a guy named Barrick. Actually, I will say some of these also came from a member session we did. We being James and the the other editors here at Hodinky. Uh for those that are sort of involved in the Hodin Key community on our mailing list and stuff like that. So if you're not, make sure to check it out and you will sort of be on future webinars with us and things like that and have the opportunity to ask us questions. But we did not have the time to get up to all of those questions. So this one came from Barrick during that session. Quite a simple question, guys, but but one that I thought we could kick off to have a little fun with. What's everyone's dream summer watch? James, why don't you start it out? An easy question, but a complex one at the same time |
| James Stacy | ? Yeah, I mean the the there's a few that jump to mind uh but the the absolute simple straightforward answer is just a a professional DOXA 200T or 300 thin case in the orange, maybe on a nice tropic rubber. That just screams summer for me. It's summer for your wrist, even if if it's |
| Tony Traina | middle of winter. Great watch. Uh you know, I took this question in a different direction, so I'm curious what Blake's answer is. |
| Blake Buettner | So I this this would probably change depending on the day or hour that you that you could ask me. Uh there's a certain watch that I have just on my mind because I've I had it in front of me and I've been photographing it this week and it's the new white uh speed master uh moon watch professional I like that a lot more than I was expect expecting to. Yeah I was worried that the gold the dial was gonna be like too glossy a shiny but it's really not. I feel like it's more satin kind of in person in that has been a great summer watch uh so far just in my brief time with it. I really love that they did the black hour markers and black hands. I feel like that's how you need to do the white dial. See the the legibility is retained, you know? Imagine if the white dial Daytona had black hour markers and like a brushed case. I mean, come on. But yeah, like that's that speedmaster with the white dial, that's that's the watch that's currently on my mind that uh is serving as a great summer watch. Hey, can you throw that on a rubber strap? It's a twenty millimeter looks, man. You could put it on uh I suppose. |
| James Stacy | Yeah. You know, I mean that the white dial Seamaster on the black rubber is pretty great. So I have to assume if you can squeeze one of those rubbers into the uh into the speedy, uh and obviously the they make some rubber straps on some of the m the precious metal models that are pretty pretty dang good on that strap. I could see that being a good combo. But Tony, what have you got for your uh ideal summer watch dream summer |
| Tony Traina | watch? Speaking of rubber, uh I was thinking of rubber because the two washes, I I have them on my desk, so I might as well just hold them up. Are the it's this hodinky unimatic that I guess we can show. Ben's mentioned it on the show before. Uh it's their their U1, but it's a carbon carbon fiber case, sort of this black carbon fiber so super light and then you put it on a rubber strap and it wears great and then as I think I've mentioned before Black Bay 58 on a tropic. But guys I took this question slightly differently and, I was crafting a watch in my brain that if it existed, I would I would love like creating your own summary. I was create yeah, it was kind of a build-your player type of thing in NBA 2K. And I was kind of doing that, and I was like, Well, I want a rubber strap, but I want a carbon case and if it's a dream watch, you know, the budget is sky's the limit. So I was kind of thinking, wouldn't it be cool if uh if Paddock made a carbon fiber aquanaut, you know, take this carbon fiber and aquanaut, and then you've got the rubber straps still. You might as well make, you know, how in the the original ones they had, yeah, in the original ones they had the bracelet, so you know, a full carbon fiber bracelet available too. I would I would love it in that old sort of five zero six five thirty-eight millimeter case. And then you know maybe at the beginning of every summer Terry Stern would call me up and he'd say hey which color, which colored rubber straps do you want this year? And I'd give him, you know, the three or four colors that I want. So that's kind of the dream summer watch for me. I I was I was dreaming a lot bigger than you guys. I mean, you went Doxa and Omega Speedmaster and I I took the question in a different way, but uh after after like after James answered, I was like, oh man, I really had my my head in the sky there. But uh that was what I was thinking of when I saw this question initially. Carbon fiber aquanaut. Crazy.. I'm here for it Yeah, that'd be nutty. Three ideas, paddock. There you go. Okay. Another question that we're going to ask now. The second question on the list is: okay, what are your thoughts on Vashir on Constantin? Obviously the 222 is a hit, and I find the steel overseas compelling, especially because it's a good bit cheaper than the most obvious alternative, i.e. the AP Royal Oak, but they get such little attention compared to Paddock and AP, I'm not sure I understand why. This actually stemmed from a conversation I had with a collector slash enthusiast over the past week and I kind of formed it into a question with their help. So guys, I guess we're gonna have the Vacheron Constantin conversation for just a little bit here and ask what your thoughts are on the brand more generally. And they asked kind of specifically about the overseas. Blake, why don't you kick it off |
| Blake Buettner | ? Uh I'll start by saying I really enjoy the two two two. I've had it on my wrist uh on a couple of occasions. Uh no issues there. Stepping back, I also had no issues with Vachron. I tend to probably appreciate their formal stuff a little bit more, their historics, their triple calendar type stuff, uh, I really love. I also really like the look of the overseas collection as a whole, uh, but they don't really get along with my wrist. Uh and that's been my biggest issue of like, you know, it just doesn't quite get the same notes as I remember when I reviewed the the new Daytona uh w when it came out and that was kind of my comment on it. I'm sure the overseas chronograph is like a arguably more interesting watch, but I don't like the way that it feels on my wrist nearly as much as I like the way that feels on my wrist. And that's kind of what it comes down to with a lot of these watches for me. So, you know, I I think the the uh the dual time watch uh that I think that both James and I have a pretty big fondness for I really love. Um but it's just not a watch that I feel like oh what what could I move around to like own one of these? It doesn't hit me |
| Tony Traina | like on that level. So you unpack what you mean by it doesn't fit well is there anything in particular or is it just the entire package? Well I |
| Blake Buettner | think it's it's like the shape of the case is is is slightly large and flat. Um and how it like the the diameter of it like I feel like it kind of sticks out a little bit beyond the the bezel piece that it has on there. Uh just the overall kind of like weight at the how it transitions into its case back just doesn't really sit naturally on my wrist. So I've never found them to be like comfortable watches or compelling on on my wrist |
| Tony Traina | . As lovely as as I think they are aesthetically. Interesting. James, he mentioned the dual time. The Corey Richards dual time, I know one of James's grail watches. Anything else to add about the overseas more broadly? |
| James Stacy | No, I mean I'm a big fan. I uh for me I think they wear really well. Uh uh I prefer the way they look on the bracelet. My wrist absolutely prefers the rubber. Uh if you've ever bought an overseas, they come with all three. Uh leather, rubber, and the matching metal. I yeah, just remain a huge fan of the dual time especially. I think the time like the time date is a a really lovely model and something that makes sense for their line. The chronograph is very cool, but w somehow wears even bigger, probably more of a visual thing at 41 millimeters and then with all of that on the dial. Uh the dual time, I like the way it's uh executed. I like that it's a little bit strange, that it's definitely not a GMT or a world time, it's like very specifically a dual time function. Uh and I I got a chance seven, I mean it was a long time ago at this point, but to hang out with one for about a week and uh really enjoyed it. I I I think the brand is um you know they're they're noteworthy because they are a little bit more subtle, certainly more subtle than a Patek or a or an AP. And then the other thing is is at least to my understanding, they don't produce the same number of watches as like an AP. So it would make sense that there may be a little bit less um in the in the Zeitgeist or kind of in in the limelight as often as AP where you you have sort of a different take on approaching members of the media of approaching, you know, celebrities and that sort of thing. And Vashron's just a little bit more subtle with that. So you end up with guys like Corey Richards instead of uh Serena Williams or something like that. So differ diffenterent, take, different sort of philosophy, but uh a really lovely product in one like if you go to a Vashiron store and try an overseas and it kind of like it it gets you, like yeah, the the good reason for that. Nicely made watch. Uh as it should for that price of course |
| Tony Traina | . Yeah, on the corporate level actually Morgan Stanley said that Vashron kind of just cracked a billion dollar mark in sales over the past year. And then I think that's probably one of the reasons their CEO, Louis Furli, I think was his name, was just sort of or will soon be promoted to the Cartier CEO role. I think he's had great success in growing that brand over the past few years. So and for for what it's worth, the Morgan Stanley report said that Vacheron produced thirty-five thousand watches last year compared to AP's fifty thousand, paddock's seventy thousand. So yeah, to your point, half the number of paddock and still quite a bit below AP, but on a growth trajectory, which is cool to see. But as far as the watches are concerned, the bracelet on the overseas in particular is best in class for me from a fit and finish perspective. Uh the way they kind of just the Maltese cross theme is there, but it's not overt and they kind of just get it right in those links and then the the finishing is just about as good as it gets the quick release and then the quick adjust or the I should say the micro adjust on the clasp is is very cool. You just kind of pull it out and you get another half a millimeter or something on the clasp, which is something really cool. And uh actually Christopher Ward emulated something like that. I I don't think Vashron was a direct inspiration for theirs, but they emulated that in their the 12 bracelet. So it's really cool to see another brand doing it at a just completely different price point because it's a really cool full functionality. But beyond that, I the one thing I want to s the one thing I want to see is I had those the new thirty-five millimeter overseason uh for review at the beginning of this year, about a year old. Now they released them at Watches and Wonders. Great watches, but for my wrist, kind of as Blake was talking about, I'm a little bit in between the 41 and the 35. The 35 is just a bit too diminutive. The 41 is just a little bit too big. So hopefully they bring back something in the 37, 39 millimeter range. They used too, but it kind of had that awkward sub seconds at nine o'clock, I think, which is kind of just a weird thing and it's it it kind of reminds you that you don't have the full size overseas and you've got something else instead. So I like that with the new thirty five they basically just made a shrunk down overseas, and I hope they do the same thing kind of in a mid-size range eventually. But other than that, there's there's a lot to love from a fit and finish perspective, especi |
| James Stacy | ally on the bracelet of the overseas. The thing that stands out for me, if we're talking about like what kind of what we hope or what we might what we might see from a brand like Vashron is is I feel like they got a lot of positive reinforcement from the Everest series, the Corey Richards, the Chronograph, and the dual time and titanium. Very sporty, like intentionally sports watches. And I would love to see them find a way to lean like directly into that angle. I think that they have so many of the other bases covered. The traditional is a great dress platform. The overseas is a great blend of like, you know, the integrated bracelets for watch experience is is often a blend of sporting elements and luxury elements into one. And I just I I figured with the level of kind of hop and attention they got for the the two Everest LEs that we might not see the same watch made and not an LE, don't do that. Uh, but make something else that would appeal to the sorts of folks who probably would have tried to figure out a way to get one of the hundred or a hundred and fifty of those watches or whatever however many they made for each. Uh, but I I would love to see them go a little bit harder into sporty stuff, maybe even kind of target something more in the vein of um like a an alpine eagle versus trying to go against a Nautilus. I I I think that could work for them, especially in, you know, it'd be I think an overseas in titanium in the standard metal would be like a fairly compelling offering for a modern take on what's becoming not so modern of |
| Tony Traina | Yeah. It's a little bit different, but when they did the collaboration with Hodinky, the the corn de Vosh, it was, you know, bringing that back in a steel format, gray dial 35 pieces or whatever Hodinki did with them. And then a couple of years later, a steel popped up in their uh just their general catalog. And that's obviously geared towards the enthusiast, but it's a completely separate thing. But it's a gorgeous watch, one of the few real LaMania-based modern chronographs that's continuing on that lineage. Uh, but it's kind of a similar thing where you can learn from a collaboration or a limited edition and then take elements of that and bring it into your general catalog, I think. Well guys, we'll leave the basar round discussion there. And one more question before I let Blake get back to his gardening out there in in the back garden his in Wisconsin and then James can head up to his cabin. And the last question I'm going to ask is from Joseph M again, this came from our webinar I think a couple of weeks ago. Why are there so few smaller, slimmer, especially manual wound dress watches produced? Do |
| James Stacy | you watches. I don't know that I fully agree with the assertion that there isn't a lot of thin dress watches available on the market right now. Um I mean depending on I mean he said hand wound, so that that at least put some sort of a limit in place. Uh yeah, I I would think that um I would think that the only reason if there is a g uh you know a sort of deficit of these sorts of watches in the market, the only reason is brands don't think that they'll sell. Uh but I definitely believe, you know, the major dressier brands are all producing something into that vein, Chopards. Uh well sorry, I guess maybe not hand wound with the LUC that's a mic |
| Tony Traina | ro rotor. I think hand wound is kind of ends up being the main limiting factor here when you start to think about it. Chopard, for example, even Rolex with the 1908 has come and it's an automatic watch. You could go on, but a lot of them tend to be automatic now. I guess the presumption is that that's what people want if they want a mechanical movement. It a little bit of the ease of not having to set it set it every day. But like what say you? Yeah, I my first reaction |
| Blake Buettner | was uh you know, kind of just questioning the premise of it. I I feel like I the last few years especially we've we've become almost spoiled for choice when it comes to size options for a lot of watches where you know maybe ten or twelve years ago it was these these real big watches that they were produced and then it kind of like swung the other way, and now it seems like we have a nice mixture of all of them and a lot more brands producing watches in multiple sizes. Um, you know, so I feel like we're in a pretty good spot in terms of like having a plenty of options for formal watches that are sized and uh you know 36, 37, 38 millimeter type range. I suppose the hand-won movement is a trickier proposition for someone that just walks into a retailer or an AD um to come to terms with. You know, I feel like you would you know uh enthusiasts, you know, kind of lament the date on a watch and stuff like that. But I always hear the people that work in the retailers say, well, it's hard to sell a watch without one. And then these are the kind of practical features. And I would see the uh you know an automatic movement be being along the same vein. So yeah, I d I do remember a few, you know, hand wound watches that have come out from kind of mainstream brands and they always position them as like the four enthusiasts or like you were paying attention to this crowd crowd. So I feel like they're they there're they're out for sure. Um but generally those watches are you know fall a little bit outside of my purview and the watches that I kind of generally pay attention to. But yeah, I guess my you know thirty thousand foot view is that I I do see a lot more watches at a lot more sizes and and with a lot more options. And if anything, I see more of kind of like blurring of the lines between the genres. So, you know, maybe it's not like a classically formal watch, but it's a watch that could be used that way, but it's also like kind of a field watch or a sport. You know, it's it's like all these brands have to these watches that are like these go anywhere, do anything type of things. So uh yeah, if anything that's where I see more of uh kind of kind of muddying of the waters, I suppose |
| James Stacy | . Yeah. Yeah, I mean in in looking for an example or or in trying to think of examples for a question asker, I I've come around to his side. There aren't that many that are actually pretty pretty uh small is one thing. I think I think the the watchworld is really agreeing on thirty eight, thirty nine as being something that like the enthusiasts are willing to buy, even if normal watch mine seems to still exist a lot around like forty two to forty five. Uh it's like two different kind of two different groups. Uh but I I I think I might I might see exactly this guy's point is as soon as you go hand wound you really do crop in on the options and it's weird that some of these brands will put a hand wound movement in a case and watch that's otherwise sometimes offered in or otherwise always offered in automatic and it doesn't make the watch that much thinner. Yeah. Or even noticeably thinner. Uh so yeah, when you get into hand wound and and smaller, my only suggestion would be like that's that's you know that's the purview of some very high-end uh in the manufacturers, like capital I, like you know, think of the Rich Epracheppis and things like that. But on the other side, if watches if a certain if you can dream up a watch that doesn't the combination doesn't really exist, it's because the brand doesn't think or or the market doesn't believe that people want to buy it. Um so unfortunately to our question asker, he might he might be somewhat limited in terms of brand new watches, but thankfully, you know, there were several decades of of a lot of thin hand wound stuff made uh in the past uh that I'm sure uh you know Tony can get you get you into with some of his articles. But yeah, I don't I I maybe came at this from the wrong uh wrong side when I first answered. I th I think you might be right. If you're willing to go automatic, there seems to be a ton of choices, but if what you r want is like slim hand wound Swiss signature sort of thing that you're you're definitely um splitting hairs at a certain point. You know, it's one or two options from a handful of brands |
| Tony Traina | . Yeah. Coming around in real time. We love to see it, James. One thing we mentioned the commercial side of it. One thing we hear from brands sometimes too is once you start to shrink down or slim down movements, it eventually comes at the cost of reliability and accuracy. And the presumption is that the modern consumer has just prioritized uh that over slimness and smallness. And it also for brands has the benefit of there not being as many warranty claims and watches coming back for service. So that's the other thing we sometimes hear from brands. Uh take it for a grain of salt if you like, but this is oftentimes the communication as to why don't you make something smaller than or uh or whatever else it is. So that's something else we hear. The one thing uh I do want to say I think that we've been talking about a little bit is or at least was mentioned by Blake is some of this stuff does seem to be cropping up. The Furlon Mari disco volante that we covered on the site recently has a hand wound Pisso 7000 one movement in it. Uh even more manually wound chronographs Furlon Mari, the Oak and Oscar, Atwood that you mentioned, James, uh more manually wound watches. But again, these are enthusiast focused pieces from from smaller brands. So |
| James Stacy | und seco it's not you don't have no options, but like you a thin is where you start 'cause like the Grand Secos aren't super thin. But gnomoses can be. They they make some genuinely thin watches, but yeah. So you're not without option, but my guess is if you've come to the point of asking us the question, you you know that almost makes a good option at the price point. Um so yeah, I think I think it's a a a fair question. And if trends I think if trends continue towards the we'll call it the cardier of it all, I think we could see more uh thin, certainly thinner dress watches, whether or not they're hand wound or not will will depend on the brand and their access to movements and that sort of thing |
| Tony Traina | . Yeah. It drives me crazy that Cartier currently and the for the last few years has not had just a standard gold man yellow gold, I should say, manually wound tank. I think they have it in rows right now, but they just haven't had the standard yellow gold tanks. One of the most classic watches of all time in their catalog. So perhaps they'll fix that after this discussion, but perhaps not. Well, guys, we'll leave that one there. And the last question comes from me, of course. Blake, first of all, can you tell us what you've been up to and then tell us what what the deep track is and where the people can find you to to send us out here on a good note. Yeah, sure thanks. So the deep tra |
| Blake Buettner | ck has really just been my way of exploring uh the things that I find interesting in this space, uh the people more importantly that I find interesting in the space. So there's a podcast that goes up uh every week where I generally interview somebody either from the industry or a collector or enthusiast, maybe that's entirely outside of the industry, to get kind of a different perspective on things. Usually have some really interesting guests on there, sometimes from the car world. Um next week I think I've got uh Andre Ferlan of Ferlamaria coming on and then um James Lambden of Anlog Shift uh coming on, those those types of people uh and we just kind of explore explore what motivates those people. I also have a editorial part of this as well, uh, thedeptrack.com, where I write about watches that I find interesting. They review old watches. I have kind of a penchant for kind of weird funky tool watches from the nineties, early two thousands, that era. Um so I yeah, I try to find those and tell their stories, you know, think like the early Fortis Cosmots, uh, and the Sico seven thousand two or or stuff like in in that vein. The uh the Zenith Rainbow Flyback, another one of my favorites, um the Zenny's EM1, stuff like that. Uh there are so many great watches out there that are more accessible than people realize, uh that are maybe from some of these kind of luxurious high-end premium brands now. Uh, but they have some really cool like kind of eras that they went through and produced some really awesome watches as a result. IWC Porsche design, like that kind of stuff is is what I want to to spend my time uncovering and telling their stories, uh, as well as finding the people that have interesting stories about these watches to tell. So uh yeah, you can find me over at thedeep track uh dot com or the deep track at the deep track on Instagram. Uh and uh yeah you can reach out to me anytime on any of those platforms. I love getting feedback |
| Tony Traina | . Well Blake, thank you for joining. It was great to have an old friend of Hodinky Radio and Hodinky back for for an episode. James, thanks for joining. Thanks as always to you for listening. And thanks to Vic Autominelli for editing. Uh just a programming note, we're going to take the next week off and then we'll have kind of an irregular schedule throughout the rest of the summer as the watch world slows down, especially in Switzerland. Of course, we never sleep here at Hodinky, but we'll slow down a little bit as some of the news slows down. But we'll be back soon in your feed, so so stay tuned. And in the meantime, thank you for listening. |