Skip to content

First Look: Bulgari, Cartier, & Hermès | Watches & Wonders 2021

Published on Sat, 10 Apr 2021 04:00:00 +0000

These three iconic design houses have very different approaches to contemporary watchmaking.

Synopsis

In this Hodinkee Radio special episode focused on Watches and Wonders coverage, hosts Stephen Pulvirent, Ben Clymer, and Jack Forster discuss three major design houses: Bulgari, Cartier, and Hermès. The trio explores how these brands have established themselves as serious watchmakers while maintaining their identity as jewelry and luxury houses.

The conversation begins with Bulgari's impressive Octofinissimo Perpetual Calendar, which sets a new world record for thinness in a self-winding perpetual calendar at just 5.8mm. Jack Forster provides detailed technical analysis, comparing it to the Audemars Piguet RD#2 and praising its legible retrograde date display and exceptional value proposition at $59,000. The hosts discuss whether Bulgari risks becoming over-identified with the Octofinissimo line, ultimately concluding that when something works this well, the brand should continue investing in it. They also touch on the new Tadao Ando collaboration featuring a ceramic case with a blue dial.

The discussion then moves to Cartier, where the hosts celebrate the brand's strategy of "playing the hits" with new versions of iconic designs. Jack is particularly enthusiastic about the return of the Cloche, especially the skeletonized version which he describes as one of the most transparent watches he's ever seen. They discuss the new Must de Cartier Tank models in burgundy, Kelly green, and blue, as well as the innovative solar-powered Tank that uses the numerals to allow light through to the photovoltaic cells. The conversation acknowledges the importance of the Ballon Bleu to Cartier's business, even if it's not the personal favorite of the hosts, and praises Cartier's ability to serve both enthusiasts and mainstream consumers.

Finally, the hosts examine Hermès' new H08, a titanium sports watch that defies easy categorization. Ben notes how the watch feels perfectly timed for the casual luxury moment of 2021, while Jack appreciates that Hermès products often transcend traditional categories like "dress" or "sport" watches. Stephen reveals that the watch has already sold through its allocation at the Hodinkee Shop with a significant waiting list, demonstrating strong consumer interest. The hosts praise the thoughtful design details, custom typography, and how the watch maintains Hermès' design philosophy while entering the competitive integrated bracelet sports watch category. The episode concludes with agreement that all three brands delivered strong offerings that reinforce their positions as serious watchmakers.

Transcript

Speaker
Ben Clymer Look, I I think nobody can rest until you're Rolex. Really, you know, and the the reason I say that is because if you talk to anybody, even in Manhattan or Los Angeles or Miami or some you know major market in the US, the majority, and I really do mean the majority of people you'll you'll meet will not have heard of anything besides Rolex
Stephen Pulvirent . Hey everybody, I'm your host Stephen Pulverant and this is Hodinky Radio. Uh we're back with another special Watches and Wonders pod. I've got Ben and Jack on the microphones again. How are you guys doing? Doing great, Steven. How are you? I'm doing good. Jack, how about you?
Jack Forster Yeah, doing uh doing pretty fantastic. Are you sick of watches yet? Actually, I have found myself kind of rejuvenated in terms of interest in watches. This has been the most exciting 24 hours uh watch-wise that we've had in an awfully long time, and I've never felt so alive
Stephen Pulvirent . Amazing. Love it. That's what I like from Jack. Well, I think you're gonna enjoy this too, because we're here to talk about some of your favorite brands, and I know some of yours as well, Ben. We're gonna talk about the design houses. We're gonna talk about Bulgary. We're gonna talk about Cartier, and we're gonna talk about Hermes. And I think you know, spoiler alert for everybody, like these three brands kicked ass. Like they really, I think did a pretty great job this year. Yeah, no, I
Ben Clymer agree. I mean that they we look all of us on this, on the Zoom have been kind of longtime supporters of of these three manufacturers in particular. And I think uh strong year all ac
Stephen Pulvirent ross the board for sure. Yeah. Well, let's dive right in. Let's go to Bulgary first. We'll go uh in in alphabetical order here, keep things fair. Jack, you want to introduce us to kind of the not just the big boy from Bulgaries lineup, but like I would say one of the more impressive watches of the entire show in the Octofinissimo QP. Yeah, the Octofinissimo Perpetual
Jack Forster Calendar was you know, I gotta say, you wonder how many worlds records a brand can break. Since they started breaking records in 2014 with the Octofenissimo line, it's been it's been seven years, it's been six world records, and uh they are just coming with amazing regularity year after year after year. The design is one that is not the octophonism aligned is not all that old, but it one of the things that's amazing to me is the fact that it's it feels like it's been around for a lot longer than it's been around. It's become iconic for Bulgary a lot faster than I would have thought would be possible back in 2014. So this is a micro rotor, automatic movement with a perpetual calendar with a retrograde date display and a r and also I think I missed this in the uh in writing the story, but also a retrograde leap year display. And it's just a fan it's a fantastic piece of technical watchmaking. And one of the most interesting things to me about it was the design of the Octafanissimo watches looks very, very it looks fairly austere. You know, it's uh it's quite, you know, sort of modernist in inspiration, uh very clean, lean, urban, you know, sort of postmodern inspired design. And uh you look under the dial, which the owners of these watches will not probably be able to do unless they either know a Bulgary watchmaker really well or they look at the press images, but there's a lot of really gorgeous looking traditional movement finishing happening under the dial as well. And more on the dial side than on the movement side
Stephen Pulvirent . Interesting. Yeah. I I think to me, the thing that struck me is like the so many of the octafinissimo iterations are like so pared down. Like you said, they can be kind of austere. And this one, I think, manages to get a lot of information on that dial while still kind of maintaining that. Like it still feels really clean and and crisp and airy it doesn't have any of that kind of like heaviness of a traditional complication yeah
Ben Clymer I mean I I I think this watch that there's two things that I find kind of interesting about this watch the first which kind of harkens back to my comment on the longa yesterday uh is that this is a perpetual calendar that is like very very legible and i think when you actually like use a perpetual calendar which i've at least tried to do in my you know recent past the day of the month is is definitely what you reference the most. And the fact that they made this kind of like central to the design here, I think, is is very smart. And then having a leap year as a retrograde is kind of neat too. The other thing that I would definitely want Jack's opinion on here is so this is now the thinnest self-binding of retro calendar. And the watch that it took that title from is the RD2 from AP, which is in some ways a very different watch, but I guess in this way a very, very similar watch. And of course, you know, really different price points, again, both integrated bracelets. I mean, how do you feel this compares Jack to the RD2? And then technically, how how differ
Jack Forster ent is it? Oh man, it it's like uh, you know, those two watches, it's like Ginger and Marianne and Gilligan's Island. Like why do I have to choose? And uh this speaking of perpetual calendars, I'm really dating myself. I mean, the bulgaries not that much thinner. They're definitely within spitting distance of each other in terms of thinness. They both have a similar strategy in terms of how to get a perpetual calendar that flat. So you look under the dial with the bulgury and the perpetual calendar works have basically been suppressed into wells cut into the bottom plate of the movement, which is a strategy that AP employed as well. The bulgury uses a micro rotor caliper, which right away gives you a little bit of an advantage in terms of trying to make things as thin as possible. The AP is based v I mean, very, very loosely. It's I'm to say that it's based on the 20120 is uh pushing it a little bit, but the automatic winding system is certainly from the 2120. And that's almost you know, that's a design from the nineteen sixties, but that's almost a peripheral rotor movement. That's as far as you can push a full rotor centrally mounted movement, I think, without actually turning it into a peripheral rotor, you know, design. And there's some conceptual similarities between the two. Gosh, the uh the AP has a moon phase and the bulgury does not. I think the AP is perhaps a little bit of more a little bit more of a romantic watch and a little bit less a sort of s exercise in cerebral design intelligence. But you get under the hood, and while there's a tremendous number of things that are different in the execution, the basic solution, which is okay, let's figure out how to get the going train out of the way, the automatic winding train out of the way, and suppress the perpetual calendar works to the same level as basically everything else in the movement. That's the thing that those two watches have in common. But they feel it I think I don't know. We we we've been talking about feeling a lot lately in talking about the uh the new watches from Wchesat and Wonders, the feeling that I get from those two watches is really, really different. And I think that they're going to appeal the common point of appeal between the two of them is going to be people who love technically forward-looking, beautifully traditionally finished perpetual calendars. But they might appeal to very beyond that, beyond people who are just, you know, like very, very financially well endowed gearheads, I feel like they're going to appeal
Ben Clymer to different groups of people. Aaron Powell Yeah. I mean it it it's funny because, you know n now that I'm looking at them I'm I I keep thinking that the R D two is platinum but it's not. The production one is also titanium. So the so the the A P and the Bulgari are both titanium on titanium bracelet, which is interesting. I think the A P is actually is not the AP production version platinum platinum on titanium? Yeah. I think it has titanium. No it's it's the other way around. So the the the prototype, like the the RD two was actually a a platinum case, uh and now it is a titanium one with with platinum accents. So it's the effectively titanium.
Stephen Pulvirent That's right. Yeah. And the funny thing here is we get there's the titanium version that's all titanium, and then there is a platinum version on a strap with with a blue dial for the bulgarian. I'm kind of curious. I mean, for me, like these octofenissimo watches are are always going to be about the full titanium versions on the titanium bracelet. Like sure, the ones on straps, the ones with different dials, like fine. But to me, it's it's this like full matte titanium look that always takes the cake. Yeah. I don't know about for you guys. Like what do you guys think?
Ben Clymer Do you have a preference between the two? Yeah, I mean the the this design, even though some of the earliest Octofenos were on strap, it it really comes alive on bracelet. I I own one of these one of the time only's and it it's a bracelet watch and I think it should be on a bracelet. You know, if it's like wearing, you know, one of those gold royal oaks that they made, you know, ten years ago on on a strap and it just like it just doesn't feel finished to me. Nothing against wearing things on a strap, but I think when you have something this slim, it it really belongs on a bracelet from my side. Yeah, and plat
Jack Forster inum was an interesting choice for Bulgary for this particular watch because to your point, Ben, the titanium is a no-brainer. It's a bead blasted titanium, it's kind of uh as much the native material for bulgaria octofenissimo as steel is for the royal oak, or as steel is for the patakphilippe nautilus. And one of the things that I think is interesting about this launch is that this is the first time that they've actually used platinum for an octofenissimo case. And the stuff is a nightmare to machine. As we all know, you know, it's uh it it dulls cutting tools at an unbelievably higher rate than just about anything that is conventionally used for watch materials. And the fact that it's such a giant nightmare to machine, I don't know if that's one of the things that kept Bulgaria away from it necessarily. I don't know if it was an aesthetic decision, but as they have moved into more traditional case finishings in the most recent steel version of the Octofenissimo Automatic, you know, and in this watch, you know, you set yourself up for a tremendous challenge in trying to make this watch in titanium. It's just it's just, it's an awful, awful, uh, you know, it's an awful material to work with just from a mach
Stephen Pulvirent inist standpoint. Totally. And then Ben alluded to this earlier, but the price on this watch is actually, I think, one of the more interesting things. In titanium on a bracelet, this watch is $59,000. That I mean, $59,000 is a lot of coin, right? Like that is a luxury car. That is like a chunk of a down payment on a house. Like that, that is a lot of money. However, for an ultra thin perpetual calendar from like a world class brand, and this is like a real integrated perpetual calendar. This isn't like some module tossed on top of an edit movement here. Right. I think that's kind of a steal. Like I I was shocked when I saw the price. Yeah, I I think the
Ben Clymer the octofenic mo has always, you know, kind of been very respectful of what it is and what it isn't. And what it is is is a wonderfully made thing by one of the most esteemed kind of jewelry houses in the world. And what it is not is an AP or a or a patek. And I think they're they're always kind of conscious of the fact that, like, okay, if the price, you know, if you're gonna have price parity with with something like a patek or an AP, like you're gonna kinda lose and and that's okay. And so I think they're just conscious of the fact that like they do need to be a little bit under and by a little bit, in this case quite a bit under, a comparable watch from an AP or Patek. And and again, you know, the the RD two or the ultra slim petrol from AP is 140,000 Swiss, you know, so more than two times the price. And that's the ultra ultra slim. If you were eating just buy the standard steel Royal Oak perpetual, I think that's probably gotta be in the 80s, you know, considerably more money still. And the these these acnofinissimos, I think, are really becoming amazing value propositions for those people that either don't want to deal with the nonsense of these, you know, incredibly comfortable Roilokes and Nautiluses or or those that just just value their their money and just don't kind of care about the brand. And that's not to say that there's anything wrong with the Bulgari brand. I mean in many ways the Bulgari brand is bigger than than both Patek and AP in the real world, just not
Jack Forster in the watch world. Yeah. Hey Ben, can I there's a question that I've wanted to ask you for a while now, and I've just sort of never gotten around to asking it. You can ask me anything, Jack. Anything. Oh boy. So uh Bulgary, you know, it's obviously a renowned jewelry house and uh they have been famous for what they do with high end jewelry in in their own design language for many, many years. Do you still think of them as a jeweler that makes watches or do you think that they've established themselves in the fine watchmaking space at this point so securely that they can kind of rest in their identity
Ben Clymer as a fine watchmaker at this point. Look, I I think nobody can rest until you're Rolex, really. You know, and the the reason I say that is because if you talk to anybody, even in Manhattan or Los Angeles or Miami or some you know major market in the US, the majority, and I really do mean the majority of people you'll you'll meet will not have heard of anything besides Rolex, even Patek or even, I mean, maybe Omega because of James Bond or the Olympics, but really not even. Uh and so I think, you know, unless you're Rolex, you've got to keep pushing. And I think, you know, it reminds me frankly of Hodinky. And it's Hodinki is this big thing in this very small world. And it's like, you know, you know, I've seen people ask for Jack's autograph and take selfies with Stephen. And then, you know, on on the street, we're just normal people. And I think that's kind of how Bulgary is is viewed here. It's like in the watch world, it is, you know, to us, to people who know, it is it is highly interesting and respected and and coveted. But but still I think they have to continue to work to kind of validate their place. Again, going back to the conversation we had yesterday, in in this kind of crazy homogeneous world of watch consumption, which really only cares about two brands, maybe three, maybe four if you include Richard Meal. But yeah, I think they do have to continue to work just as Tag Hoyer, Omega, Vashron, Longa, everybody has to work. So
Jack Forster here's another question for both of you, uh, as kind of like uh seriously dialed in watch design guys. I was talking to Fabrizio Bonamassa, who's the head of watch design at Bulgary, a couple of days ago, and I found out something really interesting, which was that their original vision for this watch was that it would have a big date. And he said that they found out, they they discovered in the course of prototyping that the big date would have made it a little bit too thick. So they moved away from that. And he wa he said he was relieved that they'd moved away from that because he felt like it would not necessarily have worked all that well with the octofenissimo design. So what do
Ben Clymer you guys think? Yeah, I mean I I think, you know, the the retrograde is definitely, you know, kind of a reference to the the bulgary stuff that they did with Gerald Gento way back when. And there were some big dates used back then. So that that would have computed. I don't think it would have looked all that great, to be totally honest with you. I'm glad they went in this direction for sure. Well Fabrizio feels the same way apparently. Good. He's also like the coolest guy there is, like the best dressed, like you know, just like dialed in guy that that there is. But yeah, I I I mean'm not actually a huge fan of retrogrades in general. I don't know why. I'm just not. But I think that this is well done, certainly. And again, I'm I'm such a huge fan of Octofinissimo. And you know, again, I I made that that that kind of like Snide remark yesterday about being like if somebody came up to me and showed me a fifty seven eleven with a green dial, I wouldn't be impressed at all. Meanwhile, if somebody came up to me with any octofenicimel on the wrist, I would be massively impressed because this like it shows that like, okay, like you you want want somet somethinghing in the style of what is very in vogue right now, which is integrated steel sports watch or you know, you know, in this case not steel titanium, but you get the idea. But you have the foresight to buy something that is less expensive, more interesting, you know, just as high quality in in many regards and and and as yours. And so I think, you know, these are watches that I really love. And again, anytime I do see somebody wearing these out on the street, I I give them serious props for sure. Yeah
Stephen Pulvirent . I I mean, I don't really have anything to add to that. I completely agree. I mean, while we're talking about design, there is another Bulgari I I want to just touch on for a second before we move on. And that is the third collaboration that they've done with Tadao Ando, the Japanese architect. Maybe my favorite living architect. And these watches are incredible. I mean the first one I absolutely love, the the titanium time only, the turbion they did in carbon. Cool. Not my favorite of them, but cool. This one is kind of a different vibe. It's not monochromatic. It's a matte ceramic case. It's got this like deep blue dial that's meant to look like the night sky. Has this little like gold sliver of a moon on it? I mean, I'll be honest, I heard there was a new Towando coming and got really excited. I think this is maybe my least favorite of the three, but still a cool watch. And and I don't know. It's it's interesting to me that this kind of pairing of this like renowned minimalist Japanese architect and this kind of like over-the-top Roman jewelry brand have come together to make ultra-thin watches out of titanium and ceramic. Like it's just such a weird thing. I'm just hoping they keep rolling with it. Like I think even if this one isn't my favorite, I'd love to keep seeing these, you know, once a year. Totally agree. Look
Ben Clymer , I think Bulgary, you know, I think has the opportunity to really create something special. And I think they already are with Octofenissimo and doing these collaborations with interesting people, which Tawanda certainly is, you know, I think really adds some cachet and and really adds something special to this. And uh I I look again, I think the first one is probably most people's favorite. I actually totally forgot about the turbulion. I don't I don't know why So
Jack Forster I you know I talked about this in the story on the perpetual calendar But do you guys think that there's a risk of Bulgary becoming over identified with a single design in the same way that some other brands have become over-identified with a single model or a single design? Interesting question
Stephen Pulvirent . Yeah. I think that risk is is always there, but I also think like if the design is a winner, like that's a problem for tomorrow. I think if people like what you're doing and if you're doing something you believe in and something that's interesting, like you can't control the hype train and just let it do its thing, keep doing good work, and like you'll figure it out. I mean, I think the brands we've seen who are actively trying to fight that don't always get it right. And like, I mean, just you know, AP is the best example of this without giving them too hard of a time here, but you know, they created code eleven fifty-nine to create something new that was not a royal oak. And look what happened. Like people still just want the royal oak. So more than ever. Who knows? Really more than ever. Yeah, exactly. More than ever. So I don't know. I mean, I think like Bulgary's got other stuff. Serpenti, they've got other other things. But my vote would be while this is working and while it's good and while they've got Fabrizio and while they've got watchmakers designing great movements, like keep it keep it rolling. Figure the other shit out tomorrow
Ben Clymer . Totally agree. I I couldn't agree more. And as as somebody that has has kind of run a business, kind of, you know, it's like when you have something that works, like don't mess with it. Like if you you know, it's really it's so hard to to make anything work. Don't want too much. And and again, I think AP they've they've is a different thing. They've they've been kind of so royal eccentric for so long. I understand why they did 1159 for sure. But as you just said, Stephen, like they have Serpenti and Serpenti is huge. It's just not huge in our world, the like the male dominated like sports watch world. Serpentie's massive. You know, I I do think because of that, like having icons in in both kind of um genres, I I think is is a good place to be. Yeah. I mean that's a great question, Jack
Jack Forster . I had a conversation with Cyril Vignon, who's the CEO of Cartier a couple of days ago, and one of the things that he emphasized over and over was like there's a new generation of enthusiasts coming up, and you know, not to give away the interview, but he said it's an easy mistake to make, but it's a big one, to think that if you have a new generation of enthusiasts, you have to make something new for Generation Z, you have to make something new for generation, you know, this generation for that generation. But the truth is, people want you to be who you are. The new generation wants the classics as much as the old older generations. And if if you think that you have to produce novelty for the sake of producing something new for this new generation that actually wants you to be true to your identity, you'
Stephen Pulvirent re making a mistake. Yeah. I agree with that. And that's also a great way to transition us over to Cartier. I did not plan that, but that Jack, I couldn't have done it any better myself, my friend. Just lobbing that one up for you, Steven. Yeah, I mean, Cartier, like that, it's clear that is Cartier's strategy, right? Like what did we get this year? We got new ballon blue, new tank, and new cloche, like and some new pascha stuff. But like oh, and the pasha stuff yeah, and the pasha. But like for us, the big stuff is tanks and cloches. Ballon blue and Phaas are huge commercially. They're obviously really important and important to that brand, but like Cartier knows to shut up and play the hits, you know, and they do it so well. Yeah. And they keep doing it year after year. And I guess like one of the questions I That's a great metaphor. They're sort of like they're sort of like a classic rock station. Yeah, they're they're playing Free Bird over and over. Exactly. But like here's the thing. I'm buying it. Like I want I just want free bird over and over again. So yeah, I mean maybe let's let's start with like the most surprising or like less least traditional thing and work our way down. And let's start with the the cloche. Jack, I I know that like the moment we all heard this was coming, like your phone must have exploded uh with people wanting Jack Forrester's take on the the new cloch. Oh my god, I I died of happiness when I found out
Jack Forster that the cloche was the next bree piece. Yeah. I mean and how do you think they turned out? I think it turned out fantastic. It's we haven't had a chance to kind of go back and look in a more thoughtful and in depth way at the different cloch models. But you know the skeleton cloch is i that's wild. It is one of the most transparent skeletonized watches that I've ever seen. The one of the traditional ways that you sort of evaluate skeletonizing in fine watchmaking is you say to yourself, okay, how transparent is it? And the the greater the transparency, sort of the more successful again from a traditional sense, you think that a skeletonized watch is. And you have to actually look twice to see the movement in this thing. And it's there. I mean there's a mechanism, but it almost feels like looking at a Cartier mystery clock on the wrist. It's a fantastically, fantastically transparent watch and a fantastic technical achievement. And it's not something that you necessarily well, you I should say I should speak for myself, it's not something that I necessarily prefer over the non-skeletonized version either. It's just such an exciting watch and it's such a wonderful connection to Cartier's past. And it represents one of the biggest challenges that I think Cartier faces. We'll talk about this a little bit more uh you know when the interviews come out with Ciro Vignon and with uh Marie Losered next week, uh who's the head of design for Cartier, and who oversaw this project. But you know, they had this incredible efflorescence of creativity that happened from the first decade of the 20th century right up through, I would say, about 1935, uh, when these designs came out, b bangang, b,ang b,ang bang, bang, bang, one after the other that are just every single one is memorable, every single one is classic. There were at least eight or nine fundamental tank models that came out during that period. That's just talking about the tanks. And the cloche is another one of those designs that you kind of can't imagine coming from anybody else. And it just was such a fantastic thing for me to see. Always a little bit more of a niche vintage model, I think. Uh you know, obviously than things like uh you know the tank or the tank centrée. But just a fantastic thing for them to go back to. Yeah. I mean
Stephen Pulvirent you mentioned tanks, right? And we we got some fun tanks this year as well. Cartier dipped into their their kind of like eighties stash and brought us some new must to Cartier tanks. Uh which you can't say eighties stash to a guy my age without me thinking of something that has nothing to do with watches. But but go on. That's that's that's fair, Jack. Didn't think of that before my time. But we got this trio of tanks in burgundy, kind of like a Kelly green and like a dark blue, not navy, but like a real blue. They're two hands. They're quartz, but I think they're awesome anyway. I mean, Ben, what what's kind of your take on these these colorful tanks? Yeah, they
Ben Clymer 're great. I mean, it's what most people want from Cartier. You know, most people that that aren't you or me or Jack or you know, or probably anybody that reads So Dinky. But again, that is the majority of humanity. So I I think they're they're great and I think they'll sell like crazy. I mean we haven't covered it yet, but they they did this this amazing kind of take on this watch that is solar powered. Yeah. Uh which kind of shows kind of how progressive Cartier is is kind of thinking about everything that they do, makes a lot of sense, comes on a strap that isn't that looks like leather but is not leather. I mean really kind of forward-thinking stuff from you know, arguably the jewelry watchmaker uh on the planet. So yeah, I I love the the the these new tanks. I I love everything they've they've done this year, definitely. Yeah. Hey Ben? Yes, sir. What did you think of the cloche, man? Oh, I love it. Anything prevey, I'm I'm all about, which is no surprise, obviously. I mean, I'm still an asymmetrique and centre kind of guy, but I mean, you know, this is wonderful, and it's exactly what Cartier should be doing, and I'm happy to see them doing it. So I, you know, I'm not criticizing them. Like they're doing exactly what they should be doing to cater to people like the three of us. And then the tank stuff caters to everybody else. And again, there's not that many brands that do that. You know, we've talked about this before, Omega does a really great job at doing the Hodinky edition, the Speedy Tuesdays, the stuff that speaks to the nerds, the enthusiasts like us. And then they do a James Bond edition that we all kind of scoff at, but like, you know, changes their revenue by like thirty percent every time a new James Bond movie comes out. And I think that's exactly what Cartier is doing here. It's like speaking to the nerd, the Jack Foresters of the World, the guy who again, I'll remind everyone literally wrote the book on Cartier. And then the the tanks are for everybody else. And I think it's great. I mean that that is that's how you build a viable business that is interest
Jack Forster ing to everyone. I I totally agree. I said this to the folks at uh Cardi in both the interviews I've had with them so far this week, but uh I would have bet real money against Cartier ever doing a solar-powered quartz version of the tank. And yet here we are. Here we are. It's a good thing you didn't, Jack. And one of the cool things about it was, you know, again, I don't want to give away the interview, but the One of the interesting things about that watch is the only thing about the dial that actually lets light through to the solar cell, the photovoltaic cell, are the numerals. And so going into the design process, they knew that there was a certain number of square millimeters of open space that they had on the dial. And you know, Cartier is obsessed with proportions. And apparently one of the biggest struggles that they had was figuring out how to configure the numerals so that enough light got through to keep this thing going for sixteen years, which is about how long they think it'll run before you need a service or a rechargeable cell replacement, but at the same time retaining the proportions that make a tank a tank
Stephen Pulvirent ? Yeah, I mean the cloche stuff definitely appeals to the real nerds. And I think the tanks sit somewhere in the middle, like we're interested, but it's it's still like pretty consumer-friendly product. And then at the the far end of that spectrum, I think when we have a watch that like none of us are particularly interested in, but is like arguably, not even arguably is the most important watch to Cartier today, which is the Ballon Blue. You know, I saw somewhere in my research as I was writing this up that at one point in the like mid-2000s, if you had separated off Ballon Blue into its own business, it would have been like the fourth or fifth largest watch brand in the world, just that business. So it's kind of hard to like overstate how important this is to Cartier. And we got a new 40 millimeter Bellon Blue with an in-house automatic movement. It's again like the Bellon Blue isn't favorite Cartier personally, but it's cool to see that Cartier is taking it seriously and that they're making sure that it kind of stays up with the rest of the pack as like a full-fledged qual
Ben Clymer ity Cartier wristwatch. Totally. And I I think that I mean Cartier in many ways is kind of like the Rolex of the jewelry world, even though we're talking about watches here. Like they did not need to kind of tweak the design and make it a little bit better fitting. They did not need to put an in house movement in this. Like nobody cares about the movement of Ballon Blue. Like not one person. But they did it anyway, at some expense, I'm sure. Uh and so again, I think that that says a lot about Cartier, and I have no doubt that this will be a you know, it it already is a massive success. It'll it'll continue to be one. Yeah, I completely ag
Stephen Pulvirent ree. All right. Well un,less you guys have any final thoughts on Cartier, maybe let's let's go to Hermes. Let's wrap things up with Hermes. It's a slightly less complicated uh situation that there's really only one big watch, but it's it's a serious watch. Uh this is called the H08. Yeah. Uh and it's a new titanium sport watch from Hermes, kind of like a I don't know, hybrid like field watch, kind of techie vibe. I don't know. Like, how would how would you guys describe the HO1? Yeah, I me
Ben Clymer an I think this is Hermes's take on something that that feels very, very 2021 and that is sports watch, casual, you know, in in the year of the pandemic or the second year of the pandemic, like nobody is wearing dress watches anymore. This feels, I obviously know they've been working on this for longer than just the last year, but this feels very of the moment. And I think if if you look at even Hermes's kind of like runway collection and and all their other kind of like lifestyle products, it has taken such a more casual approach towards things over the past say eighteen months or so, uh, that this isn't that surprising to me. I love the colors. I love that it you can get it on a bracelet, which is very, you know, nautilus-yed integrated, whatever. The orange strap, I think, is really, really nice. You know, there's some things that I would tweak. Date windows. Uh, I'm not a huge fan of some of the uh motif that they use on some of their rotors from time time to. But I think this is a great watch. And I think there's such a die hard following for them as as a brand. I mean, it is arguably the luxury brand, you know, kind of across categories, that this is going to do really well. And, you know, I I can't wait to see these in the metal. And I could see a lot of people wearing these all the time because it's titanium, it's on a rubber strap, it's cool and it's Hermes. And I I think again, if there's one thing that you can never knock Hermes for, it is their design and the typeface selection, just like with the with the slim is is is excellent and it's it's a beautiful thing. Aaron Powell And to follow
Jack Forster on with that, one of the things that I actually really like about Hermes is I can't tell a lot of the time whether they're doing something formal or something casual. None of their watches and a lot of their products don't seem to fall particularly into that category. They feel like things that have been made to a very, very high degree of attention to design, to wearability, to everyday use, but there's a degree of refinement and thoughtfulness about what they do from a design perspective that kind of transcends the whole notion of doing anything in a particular category. And so like I look at these new watches and I I I honestly can't tell whether it was intended as a dress watch. I can't tell whether it was intended as a sports watch. I can't tell whether it was intended as a casual watch. And I don't think it was actually intended to be any of those things. I think it was just intended to be
Ben Clymer a beautiful watch. Yeah. And I'm I'm actually I'm on the site right now just, you know, 'cause I hadn't I hadn't looked at the comment section and overall feedback is really positive. And that as as we all know is is is a rarity uh for any new release, let alone, you know, something that that could be described as kind of a a fashion watch. And again, it just it just kind of validates again that like the Hermeses, the, the Bulgaries, the Cartiers are are really kind of coming to their own as watchmakers. And this is very, very solid effort on on their part for sure. Yeah. I I ag
Stephen Pulvirent ree. And I think the the comparisons to the slim are interesting in that like this has its own design language. It's a completely different watch. It like they they kind of on the surface have nothing in common, but the approach taken with them is really similar, you know, to the similar way that the the Slim had the Philippe Aploy uh, you know, custom typography that kind of matched the shape of the case and really gave it its own feel. Here, like, same thing. Like these numerals have been shaped in the way that like, you know, the eights and the zeros look like the shape of this watch case. And like the four is shaped in a way that kind of, you know, is reminiscent of those kind of angular curved fours from uh you know watches from the 30s and 40s and the way that you get the multiple levels to the dial to really give you some depth and texture the mix of finishes on the bracelet like all of these things are so beautifully thought through and consistent through the product that I think it just has it it seems to me, and again I haven't seen one in the metal yet, to have some of that same like je ne saqua of the the slim where you just like you look at it and you're like, this this works and I don't quite know why, but everything is just kind of humming together. This watch has so much je ne sais quoi that Steven was obliged to say je ne sais quoi. I tried I tried not to. I was trying mid sentence to think of a different phrase to use and I I came up blank. It works. You said Genes
Jack Forster is qua and then you said I don't know literally twenty seconds later. You know, the eight and the nine are amazing. Yeah.
Stephen Pulvirent Yeah. They are. Yeah. I'll also say I won't say who it is, but I have a friend who texted me earlier today. He already purchased one of these and had it shipped and it's on his wrist. Uh and he said that like he never impulse buys watches, but the moment he saw this, he knew he needed to have it. And I don't know. Any any product that produces that kind of reaction in people is is working on some level
Ben Clymer . Yeah. So I mean the the thing, you know, before you even mention that, Stephen, I was actually so we are as of you know two days ago an authorized dealer for our mez watches and and me being me, I have the ability to go in and kind of see how how we're doing with this stuff. And we have sold through our entire allotment of these watches on the shop and we have I'm looking at our waiting list here. Wow. It's significant. Yeah. I mean, this is we I know we sold those watches that we were allocated the, you know, the first business day for sure. And we've got a good number of people that that seem interested. And I I think that, I mean, you know it, we always have you know a little bit more insight than most, but when we're actually selling the product, we have even more insight. And like the proof is in the pudding. People like it, the comments are positive, and people are buying it. And I think in this day and age, for for six, you know, between six thousand and nine thousand dollars, there are a lot of options from brands like Omega and Rolex, et cetera. And people are choosing to buy this. And I think that that is really encouraging for sure. Co
Stephen Pulvirent ol. Well, thank you guys for doing this. I know this is like what the third or fourth of these you've you've done in the last uh like 36 hours, but uh
Ben Clymer So how come I I I have a question here. How come I always get stuck with Jack? Where's like Stacy and Milton and Cole and all these other guys
Stephen Pulvirent ? Ben, that's a question I ask myself every day. Uh you know? But uh sorry, Jack. Nothing but love. But uh yeah, uh it's great to get your insight. Honestly, like I know again, Jack has literally written the book on Cartier. Well, I mean to be fair, I wrote a book on Cartier. Alright. Jack wrote a book on Cartier. I'll fix it. It's not like it's just living on your laptop. It was an actual book. A real book. It was not a bunch of photocopies from Kinko's, but uh yeah, uh it's great to get your insight and your expertise here and I'm sure I'm sure I'll drag you back on mic soon to talk about something else. Can't wait. Thanks a million Steven. Always a pleasure. Awesome. Thanks guys.