Analyzing The New Speedmaster, Reviewing An Icon, And Building A Horological Legacy¶
Published on Mon, 11 Jan 2021 11:00:00 +0000
We're less than two weeks in, and 2021 is already a busy year in watches.
Synopsis¶
This episode of Hodinkee Radio kicks off 2021 with comprehensive coverage of Omega's newly released Speedmaster Professional Moonwatch. Host Stephen Pulvirent sits down with Ben Clymer and Jack Forster to dissect this landmark release, which represents the first major technical update to the Speedmaster since the 1860s. The discussion covers the new caliber 3861 movement with its METAS certification and anti-magnetic properties, subtle design updates including the step dial and improved bracelet, and why this watch remains one of the most accessible icons in horology. The trio also compares the Speedmaster's approach to Rolex's recent Submariner update, noting how both brands chose conservative, iterative improvements to their most important heritage pieces.
The episode continues with two feature story discussions. Cole Pennington joins to talk about his vintage "Week on the Wrist" covering the Universal Genève Polerouter, explaining why this watch represents an ideal entry point into vintage collecting with its Gerald Genta design, micro-rotor movement, and aviation heritage. Stephen shares his personal connection to the Polerouter as his first serious watch purchase. Danny Milton then discusses his story about how the Rolex Day-Date became the de facto "starter watch" for NBA players, including the heartwarming tale of John Wall buying Day-Dates for his entire Washington Wizards team as Christmas gifts.
The episode concludes with a powerful narrative essay performed by actor, watchmaker, and designer Aldis Hodge from Hodinkee Magazine Volume 7. Hodge reflects on his journey from sketching watches as a teenager to founding his own horology brand, A. Hodge Atelier. He discusses the overlooked legacy of Black inventors in horology, particularly Benjamin Banneker who built America's first striking clock from wood in 1753, and how this connection to history transformed his relationship with watchmaking from craft to legacy-building.
Links¶
Transcript¶
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| Ben Clymer | The Speedmaster is an icon because it's everything a vintage watch should be. You want a steel bracelet, you want a black dial, you want hand whack. I mean those three things alone, right? Like what other watch that that's in the modern world like fits those three things right now? You know, it just it is that good |
| Stephen Pulvirent | . Hey everybody, I'm your host Stephen Polverin and this is Hodinky Radio. Welcome back. It's 2021, we've got a new year, and uh we are not wasting any time uh on what was for many of us our first or second day back at work after the holidays, Omega dropped an absolute bomb as far as watch news goes with a brand new Speedmaster Professional Moonwatch. We've had tons of coverage of it over on the site, which I recommend you go check out. But I thought it'd be fun to start our first Todinky Radio episode out with Ben and Jack telling me what makes the new moon watch new, uh, why it's such a big deal, and a little bit about what Omega has done over the last number of years to put them in a pretty unique position in the watch market. After that, I sit down with Cole and Danny to discuss a pair of stories that they've authored over the last few weeks that I personally really liked. Uh, for Cole, it's his in-depth review and video, his week on the wrist with the Universal Genève Pole Router, which is a watch that has a special place in my heart, as you'll hear. Uh, and Cole gets into all the details here, why he wanted to go deep on this watch, what prospective collectors need to know, and kind of how he picked all the little things that went into making this really incredible package. For Danny, it's a very different kind of story. It's a story about how the Rolex Daydate became the de facto starter watch for NBA players. I'm really happy to have sports back on TV, so if we can talk about sports and watches, sign me up. I'm never gonna say no to that. And then to finish out the episode, we're gonna bring you a narrative piece. Uh this is the performance of a story that actor, watchmaker, and designer Eldis Hodge wrote for volume seven of the Hodinki magazine. It's a story about how horology can sometimes be in service of something bigger, uh, ideas, ideals, uh, things like legacy and history. It's a really beautiful essay. I I can't say any more than that. Um, but please stick around to the end of the episode. Uh th this is one of my favorite things we've aired in in quite a long time. So I think it's a pretty special way to end the episode, and uh we got a lot of fun stuff for you leading up to it. So without further ado, let's do this. Hey guys, good to see you. Good to see you too, Steve. Happy New Year. Happy New Year. First pod recording of 2021. Yeah, it's been uh been a long time since I've seen uh either of your beautiful faces. It's what, it's uh January seventh when we're recording this. Uh yeah, feels a little weird to sit down and talk about watches today, but uh that's that's what we're here to do. So uh that's our job. I'm uh I'm quite quite eager to talk about watches actually champ champing at the very bit. That's that's fair Jack. Uh well we have we have a good watch to talk about. I mean, like, you know, the biggest news of 2021 in in our world so far, in in the one short week we've had, uh, is the new Omega Speedmaster moon watch, which is about as big as Watch News gets. Um So I thought I would have the two of you guys on as dedicated Speedmaster lovers to kind of walk us through what we got, why it matters, what people need to know. Like really, I want this to be like a if if somebody's interested in the Speedmaster, like hopefully they can listen to this and come away with everything they need to know. We can do that. So Jack, maybe since you wrote the story introducing the watch, uh, do you want to maybe give us like the TLDR version of this? Like what is the uh what's the top level? Like what did we get and and why does it matter to you? |
| Jack Forster | Well so what we got was this is the first really major technical update to the Speedmasters since the caliber 321 was phased out in 6869. Uh, and they started using the caliber 861 and then in the late 90s rolled out rolled out the caliber 1861. So both of those movements have seen pretty extensive use along with the 321 in uh manned space flight. And they're all evolutions of the original um uh Lamania Omega prototype project uh CH27, um you know, which actually got started back in the 1940s. So it's you know the the history of the moon watch has really been in terms of the movement anyway, has been about uh the sort of incremental evolution of this uh really kind of amazing chronograph movement that got its start um you know in the middle of the 20th century. Uh and it's kind of amazing that albeit extensively modified, it's still being used in manned space flight today |
| Stephen Pulvirent | . So the movement's obviously huge news. It's the first time it's been updated in decades, but we also got some new design updates, right, Jack? We did. And um as with the movement |
| Jack Forster | , I would be perfectly happy characterizing them as incremental. Um, you know, certainly the f it it looks like a moonwatch. It is a moonwatch. Some of the changes include the step dial, which I love. You know, it really gives some nice added depth and texture. The case is actually slightly thinner in the new version um than in the originals. We still have a heselite and a sapphire sandwich model. We have some vintage adjacent details like the dot over 90. And we have a new bracelet, which is I think probably the most significant difference in terms of user experience. It looks great, feels great. The old bracelet, the old original bracelet on the 1861 Speedmaster, you know, it was very well made, but it always felt a little heavy to me for the watch. And this one is lighter,, uh it feels more flexible on the wrist. And I think it |
| Stephen Pulvirent | just looks fantastic with the watch. Ben, what are what are your thoughts here? I mean, kind of when you first saw this watch, like we'd heard chatter that a new moon watch was coming, but when this thing dropped earlier this week at like 6 a.m. Eastern time. What what was your kind of gut reaction |
| Ben Clymer | ? It's exactly what it should be. You know, it's just a an evolution on arguably the most interesting, kind of compelling modern watch there is in in some way. The new caliber makes a big difference. The meta certification, which I don't think people really understand uh in in terms of what that really is, like that to me is is among the most kind of like ardent testers of you know kind of modern manufacturing in in Swiss watchmingak for sure. I mean it just it it takes things to a level that is far beyond even what others that that that you might be thinking do in in in their testing. So I mean this is a this is exactly what the moon watch should be. Um you know look I have long said that the the standard Heselite you know clothes case back professional is the best buy in watches at you know I think it's what 700 bucks more now I I think with the new movement and new bracelet. I think it remains one of the best buys and watches. And I think what's what's so wonderful about this from like a a watch purchasing perspective, which is you know, I think that's probably my half of the conversation, whereas Jack is like the watch making perspective, uh, you know, that there's no BS here. And it's like, okay, you can't get it yet because they haven't made it yet. Like they're not in stores yet, so fair enough. But you know, th there are other iconic chronographs, the obvious ones, the Daytona's, the you know, the basically let's just stick with the Daytona. That watch is awesome. I have one and I'm and I love it, but there's so much nonsense with it, with the secondary values and the gray market and and dealers, you know, only giving them to the clients to spend a million dollars a year, et cetera. You're never gonna get that with the moon watch. And that's wonderful, and that's great. And I think the the opportunity to walk into an omega boutique or to come on Hodinky and be able to say, like, I want this watch, I can afford it, I deserve it, this is what I want, I'm gonna get it tomorrow. That that's a really wonderful thing. And there are very few icons left in the world of watchmaking where you can do that, right? All Rolex sports watches are out. You can't do that at all. Maulus can't do that. Royal Oak can't do that. I mean so the Speedmaster is kind of one of the few really kind of like A-level iconic sports watches at the very least that, you can get whenever you want. And it might be the best one. Partly because of that, partly because it is at least, you know, half the price or less than any of the other watches I mentioned, uh, at least in the chronograph uh world. Um so look, this is exactly what we deserved. You know, this is exactly what we wanted or what I wanted. There are those special edition omegas out there that you still can't get in the three twenty one steel, uh the the um the gold watch. Um, you know, th there are special editions here and there, but like the standard special watch, you in theory will be able to buy whatever you want, and |
| Stephen Pulvirent | that is a great thing from my perspective. Yeah, I think I think that's a really good point, is that like this is a watch that is going to end up on what, tens of thousands of wrists in the next year, if not hundreds of thousands of wrists. Like this this is this is a real thing that will like make a dent in the watch market and and be meaningful change. Uh |
| Ben Clymer | That's exactly it. And it's like I I think you know we often forget, and this is again something I say often, so so so pardon me here, but like the watches that mean the most to people are the ones that that you that are, you know in, this price category, right? Like usually less than ten thousand dollars. Anything above that like people get a little kind of skittish about wearing every day. Some do anyway. Uh in that price category and you wear it every day and you know that like if something goes wrong with it, it can be serviced, it can be fixed, and then whatever. Like these are the watches that become really special parts of people's lives. And I think the speedmaster, to me, if I could criticize one thing about this watch, and I mean this sincerely, and again, I'm a very special case, but like I would love the standard Heselite Speedmaster to come with the opportunity to get a blank case back so that you could engrave it easily, because right now there's no room to engrave it. Like we just there's just too much on on the case back. Engrave it and give to somebody as a gift or to myself or whoever, like to me, this is a watch that will be as cool in fifty years as it is the day that it came out. And I would love to be able to engrave that watch. So like if I I genuinely think that's my only crit |
| Jack Forster | icism of of this watch in general. Hey Ben, I have a question for you. So we're at kind of a interesting inflection point in the history of the Speedmaster where for at least for a little while it's theoretically possible to choose between the outgoing 1861 and the incoming 3861. What are your thoughts on that? Yeah. I mean to to to |
| Ben Clymer | me, look, I th there's so many people out there, like the the the old watches, are they better or worse? You know, from a from a watchmaking perspective, they're a little bit worse or they just don't have these advantages that uh that the the thirty eight sixty one has. Will they ever be super valuable? I don't know. I mean, you know, it i i if it were me, I would I would buy the brand new watch. You know, I mean like I I I'm a believer in new watches should perform as as as well as they possibly can. And Omega has said, hey, we we have advanced the the capabilities of this watch and it's it's 700 bucks difference. Um if it were me, I would buy the new one for sure. Uh having said that, I know there I'm I'm sure there are people speculating that the the old eighteen sixty ones will will pop in value or whatever. I was just I'm wearing the Hodinki Speedmaster right now and looking at it and and my dot is not over ninety. And I was just wondering if there's a moment in time in the future where the dot over ninety will be looked down on will be like hey like I actually I want the I want the dot to the side of ninety. You know and I like it it like the watchmakers are that dumb and this world is that is that silly? Where like that could definitely become a thing. But if it were me, I would buy the new wash all day. And look, I I I just might. You know, I don't I don't own I own a vintage moon wash, I own I own a twenty nine ninety eight, which is kind of a pre moon. Um I might buy one of these, you know, just the standard Heslight washes and wear it all the time as as kind of a daily watch because again it's like it's the perfect watch to to pass down to somebody to give as a gift um you know to to wear every day and just enjoy |
| Jack Forster | I mean it's an interesting uh it's an interesting problem, right? Because you know, on the one hand, you know, the 861, 1861 speedmasters, those things have been flying, you know, going to space for 50 years. And uh, you know, there's they're still up there on the ISS as we speak. On the other hand, you know, uh as a piece of equipment, as a practically speaking, there's absolutely no question that the new watch is technically superior. It's more accurate, uh, it's tested more rigorously, the resistance to magnetism is just there's there's there's no comparison to be made there at all. Um it's probably one of the toughest, most technically sophisticated hand-whung chronograph movements uh in the world right now. And you know, you can still get it for an awfully for an awfully awfully reasonable price. You can get a watch with real history that is not a radical break with the past. I think it's still uh it's an incremental upgrade, but that's what the entire history of the Speedmaster is about anyway. You know, and oh oh and the bracelet's nicer |
| Ben Clymer | . I mean look I I exactly. And I I think I remember a conversation I had with William Rohr many years ago, William Cena, for for those who who know him by that name, I guess. You know, many, many ten plus years ago. And we were talking about the speedmaster, and he's like he,y, like the speedmaster is an icon because it's everything a vintage watch should be. Like if you're a nerd like me, like you want a steel bracelet, you want a black dial, you want hand wound. I mean those three things alone, right? Like what other watch that that's in the modern world like fits those three things right now? You know, in in this price category? Like can you think of another hand wound chronograph that is iconic that has a black three register black dial on a bracelet in this range? I mean, forget the fact that it went to the goddamn moon. I mean, like they're that that's a whole nother thing. But like, you know, just if it were even without the moon, if this were just a hand-wound lacktyal steel chronograph on steel bracelet and Omega had stopped making the Speedmaster fifty years ago and brought it out today, we'd all be like, This is the coolest watch ever. You know, it just it is that good. And I think that is what people often forget for for a watch guy. Look, I mean I'm I'm wearing a hand wound speedmaster right now. But a hand wound chronograph to me, like that's watchmingak like that that's a special thing. I I obviously understand the value and and kind of practicality of an automatic watch. But you know for a a dork, which you know something tells me if if you're listening to this podcast, like you probably identify as a dork in some way. Um like a speedmaster is pretty tough to be |
| Stephen Pulvirent | at. Yeah, I I totally agree. And I mean to both your points, like this watch came out and despite the fact that I I don't know, I probably see a speedmaster more days than I don't just in this line of work. Like it is a thing I see probably four or five days a week. I still saw this and was like, oh, oh shit, this is cool. You know, and and that is that kind of like je ne sais quoi of this watch is is not, I think, something we should undersell. How just like flat out cool it is. |
| Jack Forster | Yeah, you know, it's funny. I uh the speedmaster I'm wearing right now is was my first you know good Swiss watch many, many years ago um when I finally started making a little money and I was able to finally able to afford it after wanting one since 1968, by the way. So like my best case scenario uh with the eighteen sixty one and the 30 eight sixty one is I buy an extra eighteen sixty one because you know why not have you know one for one for rocking and one for stocking and uh and also buy a thirty eight sixty one and uh that covers all the bases and yeah. So |
| Ben Clymer | you are you doing that? I mean we we can take a deposit right now, Jack. |
| Jack Forster | But uh it I I mean in a perfect world, you know, w if if I suddenly f found more uh change in the sofa cushions than could possibly exist there in a physically real world, I would that's |
| Ben Clymer | what I would do. uh on the call here is like the two gold watches, the two gold versions of these watches. I we've been waiting for this forever. I mean forever. You know, and it's one the the the moonshine was awesome. I mean that was among you know among one of the cooler watches to come about come out in the last few years. I think the standard non limited one may be better looking. You know, without the little zirconium thing or whatever is on the dial, um black dial. I mean it really looks like a a gold chronograph on gold bracelet. Uh the white gold uh i is a killer, the canopis gold. Um canopus? Cannabis? Canopus? I think it's canopis. Not cannabis. It's not cannabis, right? You can pronounce it that way. Um yeah. Um I mean these are awesome and the these speak to a a totally different type of person. You know, the the the guy like me, frankly, the guy who's got a some watches for sure and has kind of been around the block with Speedmaster a few times. These are awesome, awesome watches and they have the same bracelet, same movement, same everything. And again, I don't know how available these are going to be. You know, these are, I believe, boutique only, or at least the sednec gold is boutique only. Um, but you know, they're they're really compelling, beautifully made, beautifully designed watches that are that are right in line with what you would see from Daytona or something like that. And again, it's just as a guy who as the community even you know loves to poke fun of me about it. Like I love the Daytona. There's no question about that. But the Sedpe master is just purer. It just it just is. You know, it is just there's no BS there. And I I really appreciate that about it. Even in in the in the gold versions. I I hope anyway |
| Jack Forster | . Yeah, I gotta say honestly, uh you know, even in uh a world very different from this one where y you know cross shopping uh Daytona versus a new you know one of the new speedmasters was a real option instead of a theoretical one, they're just such different watches. They have a completely different completely different history, you know, completely different reasons for for for liking them. And you know, the same the same person can love both absolutely love both, but just for completely different reasons |
| Ben Clymer | . Exactly right. And and I and I think they they say dramatically different things about their wear to to me. You know, I can't say what they say to other people, but like if I saw a guy wearing a gold Daytona, I would think one thing. If I saw a guy wearing a gold speed master, I would think something else entirely. And I'm not saying one is better than the worst. And and again, to be clear, I own a gold daytona, so I'm not speaking ill of it, but it's just it's just a dramatically different mood. You know, it's it's a it's different aura. The energy is is is different. Yeah. I completely agree. And again, the speedmaster just feels |
| Stephen Pulvirent | feels a little bit more pure to me. I wanted to ask you, you know, we're comparing the speedy and the Daytona, which is is obvious for lots of reasons, but the other thing I want to compare is the Speedmaster and the Submariner. Because to get huge revamps of both of those watches in, you know, I guess less than 12 months is a pretty big deal. Like I think those are probably two of the five most important, probably two of the three most important watches of the 20th century. Uh and I think it's telling that both Rolex and Omega revamped these watches, but did it in a a sort of conservative, quiet, iterative way, um as opposed to doing something crazy or going for some like, you know, heritage model or whatever. And I wonder if you guys think that that's is the is that a path forward for kind of keeping these types of watches interesting or is there something else we we could see in the future |
| Ben Clymer | ? Well I'm I'm I'll hap happily go first here. So, you know, as as you guys know, I write for I write the monthly watch column for GQ and and when they were like, Hey, what are the two watches of the year? Right? I mean, I was like, okay, there's some crazy Royal Oaks and Richard Meals and all that, but like to me it was the 321 speed master and the the the new summer that is the ultimate two watch collection I think this watch is would replace the three twenty one as as kind of like the watch to have if you were going to do two. But I I think the the simple truth here Ste,ven is, like there's a reason like Porsche makes the Tican, the the electric car, there's a reason they didn't put that in the nine eleven first. You know what I mean? It's like th there are there are certain legacies that you just don't mess with, at least out of the gate, uh in a d in a dramatic way. I'm sure there will be an electric nine eleven at some point after they've worked out all the kinks and you know done all the testing, etc. But the submariner and and the speedmaster are those as you said, I mean these are I I think you're right. I think these are probably two of the top three most important kind of like commercial watches in the world, um, certainly for our community. And you know, the why mess with success? Those are both dramatic, uh, you know, those are both dramatic uh significant portions of each respective company's uh you know kind of commercial ambitions each year. Uh and they're working. And by the way, like, you know, look, I mean, is as you guys all know, like we're an authorized dealer for Omega. We sell new moon watches all freaking day day, every. You know, it doesn't matter if it's a Friday or a Tuesday, if it's a holiday or not, like people buy those watches every day. The same would be true for a Date Just or a Samariner back when you could get those, et cetera. Uh so there they're no one's looking to to mess with that formula at all. And I and I I love to see it because you know we see so many outlandish kind of iterations of of icons um you know over the years and and these are just pure and both of them were were executed perfectly from my perspective |
| Jack Forster | . Stephen you did uh uh a lot of our coverage of the new submariner and now we have the new Speedmaster coming out um and you know it's interesting because they both represent movement upgrades uh with very, very, very subtle uh physical upgrades. L |
| Stephen Pulvirent | ike do you see a parallel there? Yeah, absolutely. I think it's it's a really similar strategy. And what what kind of surprises me about it, I think each of these watches in isolation, it makes perfect sense. Like Ben said, like why would you mess with success here? Why would you risk kind of like upsetting the Apple cart here? Um, but I think it's it's strange to me to, see Omega and Rolex kind of take the same approach with their two biggest icons because I think over the last couple of years we've seen those two brands take very different approaches. I mean, Rolex has been the much more conservative, slower moving. I mean, like, you know, we we talk about this on this show all the time, but like for the 50th anniversary of the Daytona, like we did not get the steel watch that we thought we were all going to get. That took another year or two, you know. We don't always get the kind of like fan service, like straight down the middle answer from Rolex. We get the slow, conservative, uh like business-minded almost kind of answer. Umega has really been in the business of of servicing the community and and keeping enthusiasts happy and releasing special editions and vintage throwbacks and all this stuff. So I'm not surprised to see either of these watches treated this way, but seeing them side by side, it's it's interesting to see Rolex and Omega kind of attack the problem the same way. Yeah, it's a funny thing, you know, um I mean both of those watches uh would be a great one watch collection. Yeah |
| Ben Clymer | . Yo of of Omega. I don't know of another brand or another man, frankly, who does what you just said, Steven, better, right? They have they are a massive brand. And I think people tend to forget because you know the US in particular is so kind of like Rolex centric, you know, like it's Rolex or nothing to so many people. Omega is the second biggest brand in the watch world, right? I mean they they sponsor the goddamn Olympics, right? They sponsor James Bond. They've got Cindy Crawford as an ambassador, by the way. Very jealous that you got to do that uh podcast with you um know it's like they they are a massive brand these are not like an underdog uh in any way it's a multi-billion dollar brand they're bigger than Rolex in parts of Asia even in Europe as well at and in certain places like this is a huge brand and they do things very differently. Uh and I think the fact that, for example, that Reynold was nice enough to fly to New York to appear at H10, uh, along with a few other folks in the industry for sure, like that says a lot. Like, you know, that video, I don't know, hasn't been viewed by that many people, but that he understands how important the watch community is to not only Omega, but to watches in general. And Rolex, if I can say, I don't think needs that. And I I think they understand how important the enthusiast market is, but I I think they they believe that because the brand is so strong, and it is in the US at the very least, they don't need to kind of to do the things that that the community really cares about. And sometimes it almost feels, you know, you're referencing the platinum watch for the 50th anniversary. It almost feels like they're kind of like screwing with you a little bit. Like just like you deserve, like, I mean, you deserve a steel watch for the 50th anniversary. Everybody would would love one. And like, no, we're going to give you an ice baby blue tile with a brown ceramic bezel in platinum for seventy-five thousand dollars. And like, you know, it's funny. And it's just like this is just part of of the world in which we live and operate. Uh, but I think Omega does that spectacularly well where they they they can sell constellations in mass to tourists um uh just like rolex sells date just in mass to tourists um but um they also you know pay attention to what the the geeks want, you know, the the nerds, the the Jack Forresters of the world. And I think that that's really a special attribute of Omega for sure. And to be clear, they don't need to do that. They really don't. Like they're they're doing just fine, you know, and I think it it's really says a lot about their leadership that that that they do do it |
| Jack Forster | . Yeah, you know, it's that's a really interesting point, Ben. And um I sort of feel like this kind of uh characterological difference between the approaches that these two brands take, you know, this goes back years and years and years and years. I mean Omega's always been, you know, the brand that uh seems to have uh a little bit more willingness to play around with design, to introduce new SKUs, flood stuff on the market, see what works uh and what doesn't. And you know, you see I think you pick any given year there's probably a broader product offering from Omega than there is from Rolex. Um we know so you have this one brand which has chosen incremental improvements on a few core models uh or relatively few core models. And on the other hand, you have a company which historically has uh you know done a just a a huge, huge range of watch making and has never really abandoned any of the basic sort of collection verticals that it has |
| Ben Clymer | . Yeahah,. ye That that that's exactly right. And I think you know the there's so many things. Looking at the numbers themselves. And I and I mentioned one in the story I wrote a few weeks ago about uh the Phillips result, right? Like everyone thinks you buy a patek, it's gonna go up in value. Like that's just objectively inaccurate, right? You buy a Nautilus at retail, it might go up in value, and it will. Buy a calatrava, a complication, any real complication, it does not go up in value. Yeah, and so I my idea was that, you know, by percentage of collection the longas might actually be better uh better investments if that's what you care about than that. Is that true? I don't know. But it it's worth exploring. Similarly, I mean I was reading James Stacy's great story, though, the the buyer's guide to the new speedmaster today, and somebody's like, I can't believe how many limited editions there are, how many different versions of the Speedmaster? Take a look at how many different versions of the date just exist. I guarantee you it is significantly higher than the number of speedmasters. Like I just like I guarantee it. You know, we don't, it's not called a limited edition or anything like that, but like the the iteration that that Rolex has done on date just or date eight or any of these things is dramatic. It's the core of their uh collection. You know, we talk about this all the time that like the number one selling Rolex in history, we believe, unconfirmed, but we believe is the two-tone ladies date chest. That is the foundation of Rolex's success. Uh what's the foundation of Omega's success? It's not Speedmaster, not in the US anyway, but it could be. And I think that is the way that they treat it. Like they iterate on it so that it becomes kind of the blanket that represents the the the the meat of of their market. And so again, I I understand it's like there's a lot more press releases from Omega about limited edition watches. But if you view them all as just iterations on a family line, I would I would almost guarantee you that that that there are more date just in this world than than Speedmasters |
| Jack Forster | . Yeah, you know, I mean it's a kind of a flat footed thing to point out, but the other thing is they they sell them. You know? I mean Absolutely. You know, the most the most recent uh you know, the most recent Snoopy. Good lu |
| Ben Clymer | ck. Yeah, good luck. interesting thing that that Reynold has has told us I think in that um in that H10 uh discussion was you know I kind of prodded him a little bit on the James Bond stuff right like we all love James Bond there's no question about that nobody would say otherwise. We all love Omega. For some reason, our community doesn't jive with the James Bond Omegas. Like it's just it feels a little too on the nose, or I don't know, something. And I brought that up in H10. He said, you know what? Like that is we see dramatic upticks in sale in sell through across the family every time a James Bond movie comes out. You know, and so it's just like there's this community that is very, very opinionated, and then there is reality, you know, and I think you know when you look at stuff like that, so if you're the global CEO of a multi-billion dollar brand and you have an affiliation with arguably the coolest character in in modern literature, James Bond, why wouldn't you push that, especially if it brings you double digit sales grow |
| Stephen Pulvirent | th every time the movie comes out, you know? I think one of the one of the things that stands out to me, and and I think you've both touched on it here, is Omega does a really good job threading that needle. And I think that might be a good a good place for us to kind of wrap this conversation is they manage to do the big stuff. They do the Olympics. They do James Bond. They produce, you know, the constellation and sell them in droves, but they can also make a 321 Speedmaster or a new Hesalite Moon watch and the enthusiasts go crazy and like nobody I I don't know anyone and and you know maybe you guys do I don't know any like real watch lovers who when the new James Bond watch comes out, even if it's something they're not interested in at all, like nobody looks at that and goes like, ugh, I kind of like, it makes me like my Speedmaster less. You know? Nobody thinks that like they they can do both, and that's that's a I think unique strength for them in in this world. Oh yeah, absolutely. All right, so to finish things up, I gotta ask, now that we have these new moon watches. I efither of you could have any speedmaster that's currently available, it can be a moonwatch, it can be the 321, it can be anything. Price isn't a isn't a factor here. You just get one speedmaster to we daary in, day out. Which one are you guys rocking |
| Ben Clymer | ? So let me let me ask you some questions. Is this the only watch you're gonna wear for the rest of your life or is this just like one that's gonna slot into your current collection? Uh |
| Stephen Pulvirent | let's say let's say it's it's your cr in your current collection. Let's say it's in your current collection. But you're gonna really wear it. It's not it's not sitting in a safe. J |
| Jack Forster | ack? Well, I already own an eighteen sixty one and for all that I'd like to sort of fantasize about hoarding them, uh practically speaking, and uh you know, just in terms of I I would probably want to do thirty eight sixty one at this point. Um number one, I already have an eighteen sixty one, and number two, like my big fear was that it would feel that adopting the 3861 would feel too disruptive. It would feel like a break with um you know, with the moon watch tradition. Uh but it doesn't. You know, the longer I look at the movement, the more I sort of realize, okay, this is like one in a series of incremental improvements, changes that have been made in this movement over a period, you know, starting starting in 1947 and going all the way up to the present day. Um, and it doesn't feel like a break with the past. Um, it is uh still a flight qualified uh you know speedmaster with uh you know all the tactical improvements that you could possibly desire. It's uh and I think as a daily wearer, it's very, very hard to beat. |
| Ben Clymer | For me, uh sliding into current collection, it would be the white gold canopis uh new 3861. If if you had said this is one watch you have to wear for the rest of your life, like kind of every day, it would have been the steel ed white 321 for sure |
| Stephen Pulvirent | . Yeah, I think I'm kind of a toss-up between the Steel 321 Ed White and the uh thirty-eight sixty one Heselite. Um I will embarrassingly admit, I think I've probably admitted this on this show before, but uh I have never owned a Speedmaster, which I know is like a major watch guy sin, uh, especially as a space nerd. Uh I've just like never found the one that I really want. Uh that like when I put it on, I'm like, oh, I need this. Uh but I've been feeling that way lately, and I've definitely spent a lot of time reading Jack's many, many Speedmaster stories. So I think either one of those would make me a very happy person. Yeah. |
| Ben Clymer | I think the one thing, and sorry to kind of take a sidebar here, but it got me thinking because I was thinking about what Speedmaster could I see on Stephen J. Pulverant's wrist. And to me, it probably is like first Omega in space, the smaller, you know, 39.7 millimeter case, which is what what I'm wearing. Um let's talk a little bit about the first omega in space. Right? I mean that that is actually, I can tell you, I'll give you a little behind the curtain, that is actually the Hodinky shop's number one selling Omega. That watch goes like crazy. And that does not come on a bracelet, uh, you know, smaller case, etc. So that we we believe, right, Jack, is the last in production speedmaster that has the eighteen sixty one in it? Yeah, that is correct as far as I know. Um Yeah. It's I mean that that to me feels because like the they're always gonna make the the hazelite and the sandwich, forty two millimeter curved lugs. They're always gonna do that. They they don't necessarily always have to make the first omega in space, especially now that they're using similar case in um in the three twenty one, the Ed White style. So I it like yeah again, I know nothing sincerely, but it it feels like the first Omega in space could be an interesting play for those looking for something that like might be discontinued and might not come back anytime soon. Or be I shouldn't say might not be replaced with anything so that |
| Jack Forster | 's a really interesting alternative. Also, by the way, uh just to backtrack a little bit, um when you posed this question to us, Stephen, I was just thinking about the four new models that were released and I forgot all about the three twenty-one. So can I have a do-over? Sure, sure, Jack. We'll uh we'll sit down and do the do the whole thing over. I actually uh now to be I've got to be completely honest, uh for a daily wear just because I am kind of a you know precision a little bit of a precision fanatic and I I really like what the 3861 represents. I would still have a really hard shut time choosing between the two, but I suspect push game to shove. I don't know |
| Stephen Pulvirent | . Jack just wants all the speed masters. That's the moral of the story today is Jack needs all the speedmasters. That's the problem. I want the damn Snoopy that you can't get anymore with this little spaceship that goes around the moon. Awesome. Well, thanks for doing this, guys. Uh what a hell of a way to start 2021, man. New new moon watch. New moon watch. Yeah. Yep. It's a whole new year. And up next, we've got my conversation with Colin Danny about the Universal Genève Pole Router and why the day date is so popular in the MBA |
| Ben Clymer | . Hey guys, how you doing? Happy New Year |
| Cole Pennington | . Happy New Year, Steven. Hey Cole. Danny, Steven. Welcome to 2021. Off to a great start. I know man. |
| Stephen Pulvirent | It's uh it's wild. Um well cool. Well thank you guys for joining me. Uh I thought we're we're kicking the gear off. We're just talking through some some fun stories that have appeared on the site. Um weirdly, like kind of a big big start to the watch world, less than a year in uh less than a week into the year. But uh yeah, I just thought it'd be fun to have both of you on, talk about a story that each of you's us written recently and kind of get get a little round table going here. Does that that work for you guys? Yeah, I think I could manage that. Perfect. Whatever you say, go, Steven. Whatever you say. I'm here. This is why I love the pod. Here, I'm I'm the boss here. Everybody, everybody falls into line. It's amazing. Uh all right. Let's let's start things off with a story that uh we've been talking about this one for a while and I'm super glad we finally got it out the door and and in the way we did. Uh and that's Cole's week on the wrist. It's a vintage week on the wrist, uh and it's with the Universal Genève Pole Router. Um maybe let's have Cole start by giving us a sense of like why the pole router? Like when we were sitting around a table brainstorming vintage watches to do weeks on the wrist with. Why the pole router |
| Cole Pennington | ? The the thesis of the week on the wrist is that the pole router is a great place to start in vintage watches and it's also emblematic of everything that we love about vintage watches. And there's plenty of meat on the bone to dig into when it comes to this watch. Uh it has an incredible amount of lore. It's a watch that a lot of people find their way into vintage with. And it's one that I actually like kind of have a personal connection to because of the aviation backstory. So I was uh you know, a huge proponent of Getting this week and then it's done. So I think that is that's kind of why the pole router and and why now, I guess even further, is that finally we're at the the space where we can have some room, some latitude to experiment. So this video is a little bit different. The tone, feel, mood of it is a little more fun and lively. And we thought with weak on the wrist vintage edition, this would be a great time to experiment and try something new. So this is the perfect wash to do it with |
| Stephen Pulvirent | . Yeah, I I I'll I'll you know, peel the curtain back here a little bit. People may know this story already, but you know, I as I was watching the video toward the end, you kinda say like this is a perfect place to start for somebody interested in vintage watches. That they're reasonably priced, they have real history. Uh and I'll I'll admit, that's where I started with vintage watches. Uh, you know, when I was a a graduate student, uh, you know, working as as a journalist part-time. I knew very little about watches. I read Hodinky. This was 2011, I guess. Uh I knew I wanted a watch to celebrate when I got my master's degree. Um I I knew I wanted something with some history. I was looking at things like Omega C masters. I was looking at uh, you know, kind of fantasizing maybe about a date just, but that was way beyond my budget at the time. Um, you know, looking at some tutors, all all these things. And one day I stumbled upon the pole router. And I remember seeing it for the first time and being like, oh, oh, I I can afford this, you know? And and at the time I was looking to spend about a thousand bucks and I saved up all year for it. You know, I set money aside from all my paychecks at my part-time job at the university press. And like it really it was big, big deal for me. And I ended up buying one. Funnily enough, I ended up buying it through uh somebody Ben knows uh right as I was starting at Hodinky. But uh I still have the watch. I wore it at my wedding. Um I absolutely love it. And I I have one of the uh you know, steel twisted lug, uh asymmetrical date window, uh micro rotor movement, like the real classic pole router date um model. And that watch still to me, you know, now it's one of the less expensive watches in my collection. And it it is still like every time I look at it and wear it, it just puts such a smile on my face |
| Cole Pennington | . It's a powerful watch. I mean, and and a lot of people feel that way. And I think after this video came out, what I thought was most interesting about this is while your story is unique, it's also a pretty common scenario for people to find their way in, right? However, when the video came out, everyone was so laudatory, thank you for shedding light on this uh you know underappreciated watch. And I never actually thought it was that underappreciated. I didn't know that so many people uh thought it was a underrated watch. I thought it was a you know an open secret how good it is. But it turns out, you know, a lot of people didn't know about the pole runner. So you're a trendsetter. You're way, way ahead of your time, Stephen |
| Stephen Pulvirent | . I I don't think that's the case because I found it somewhere. So as as a neophyte, I I had to have a leader, so I don't remember where I saw it, but it it just has so much story to it. I mean the the connection to mid century aviation, the fact that it was Gerald Genta's first real design and you know, for a kid who was like twenty two and like living in a you know studio apartment on the south side of Chicago, like you know, a Royal Oak was like you might as well But I could I could have that. And it's it's one of the first, if not the first, micro rotor movements. It's like it's really an amazing little gem of mid-century watchmaking. Uh and I I think you did a really good job capturing that. And Davey, who who produced the video, did a really amazing job of capturing that feel in the video as well. Um I mean I wonder Danny, I mean Cole and I have kind of been going back and forth here, but like what's your, you know, experience with the pole router if you if you have it |
| Ben Clymer | ? So I don't have a ton of experience with it, but I think based on what you were saying before, I equate it a lot to those vintage thirty four millimeter seamasters, which I've written about. To me, they're a similar aesthetic, they're of a similar era. There's so many of them, almost like in innumerable variation, you know, where you couldn't even do a reference points because I don't even think it's possible to track them all down. I think in the video, Cole, wasn't there thousands of different references or models in a certain subsection? Aaron P |
| Cole Pennington | owell Just under a thousand. And that's using data that's extrapolated from serialized reference numbers, right? Serial numbers too. So we think there' |
| Ben Clymer | s around a thousand, yes. And just to peel back the curtain one more step, I mean I happened to run into Cole at Hodiki HQ the day he was filming this and I walked into the office and of course classic Cole, one of his week on the wrists, he's driving a race car. This one I walk into the office and there's just hundreds of watches just out on a table for a week on the wrist, which generally speaking we, you know, feature one watch. And I'm thinking, of course, you know, if Cole's doing this, this like this is an elevated version of whatever it is we're doing. And it was it was very impressive. Um when I saw it come together, 'cause I heard rumblings, you know, we we hear some of the behind the scenes stuff of props we might need, and when I saw the whole aesthetic with the television and the computer and and that whole sort of the whole theme. It was really incredible, Cole. It was so fun, honestly. |
| Cole Pennington | Thank you so much. There is one one pretty interesting thing here. So to get that computer, uh this is a little backstory here. So I went on Craigslist and you know typed like old computer or whatever. And uh one does. Yeah, of course. So what we did is we used the screen as a green screen. So Davy did this. So Davy filmed the computer, um and then you know superimposed old watch stuff on it. So to get the computer, I go to Craigslist, type in old computer, and find a props warehouse that supplied Broadway uh in western New Jersey out near the Pennsylvania border. And you know, I even I even lowballed the person, believe it or not. I just uh I threw out a you know a number, maybe half of what they were asking or something like that. And I went and I picked up that old computer. And uh and because Broadway has been a bit dry and plays haven't been going on or whatever, they really wanted to unload the old computer. So that's the backstory of that thing. We went to a process warehouse, bought the computer, and used it for weekend there. That's too funny |
| Stephen Pulvirent | . I I want to know why you've made a pretty significant choice here, which is you know, we talked about there's thousand uh potentially almost a thousand pole router models. There's dozens of them featured in the the photography and the the video. Um why did you choose to highlight this particular gold pole router in the story because it's it's really the one at the center of things and it's a it's a gold pole router super with the black dial, the asymmetrical date window, uh signed crown. Um why this one? Why was this the the highlight for you? |
| Cole Pennington | So we borrowed the watches from a prominent collector in New York. And I went and I picked up a shopping bag full of a ton of precious metal pole routers, steel, everything. And we laid them all out and kind of came to a point where like, okay, well, we need to boil it down to one. A week on the wrist generally focuses on one. It's not weeks on the wrists and watches, right? So we had to pick one. And this execution. So once they were all out on the table, that one just there was a moment where everything else faded away and it was like a spotlight came down from heaven and and shined right down on that watch. And uh Davey and I said, This is the one. This is the one that looks the best and it's just really, really beautiful. And uh we picked that one to represent the pole router. The the move would have been to go the execution you have. But we like to kind of switch it up. Plus I think precious metal pole routers are on the dopness scale are even more dope than stainless ste |
| Stephen Pulvirent | el executions. Dude, I'm I'm not gonna lie, like gold's pole router was not on my radar when I was looking originally. It was like it was steel all day. Uh I I''mm kind of into the idea of a gold pole router. Like I might have to add another one to my collection. I don't own like a I own one gold watch. It's a very tiny, thin, longine dress watch that belonged to my great-grandfather. But otherwise my collection is is all steel and titanium. Uh and I can ceramic and ceramic, that's true. I I kinda want a little uh yellow gold pole router |
| Cole Pennington | now. They're they're awesome. I mean they're I the the gold to me also I'm not like unlike James I'm not a a gold stan however watches like that from the right period or whatever gold really works and and just shines. And and this is a good example. Plus the original SAS examples well, okay, the later of the SAS examples came in gold, in yellow gold, 18 karat. So so that's kind of why too. |
| Stephen Pulvirent | Yeah. Danny, I kinda want your take on on this next thing and and it's I think the polar router is an interesting watch because it illustrates a bigger point, which is that, you know, when this watch came out, it was kind of a sport watch. Like it was it served the same function as like a GMT master. Like it was meant for for pilots. It's a pilot's watch. Uh yet we look at it today and I think most people would describe it as a dress watch or a dressy watch. And I wonder how you think those n a watch like this maybe disrupts our notions of what a dress watch is versus what a sport watch is |
| Ben Clymer | I think it comes down to size why people say that, but ultimately aesthetically, I'm gonna bring it back to what I was talking about before with the Omega. I don't look at my Seamaster as a dress watch. Size wise, it it would be from afar, but the aesthetic choices made in the design of both of those watches are inherently meant to be everyday sport watches. I don't even know that they would have called them sport watches of their of their time, or even tool watches, but they're not dress watches. They just aren't. They just there's something about the design of a dress watch that you look at it and you know this was meant to be worn with a certain type of attire for a certain type of occasion, and these just scream the complete polar opposite of that. Now I think it's cool to go against the grain into wear watches that are not dress watches as dress watches. I think it helps when something is a smaller size, thirty three, thirty four, thirty five millimeters. But I still couldn't just based on aesthetic alone, I couldn't place it in that, you know, in that category. Did did you wear |
| Stephen Pulvirent | a tux for your wedding, Steven? I did not. I wore a uh I wore a suit. Well is it is it traditional or a suit or a tux? A suit, right? Maybe I mean a tux a tux would in theory be more traditional, but we we did not do that formal of a wedding. It was a slightly more uh chill chill affair |
| Cole Pennington | . So you you had to make exactly what Danny's talking about. You had you can do these crossroads. I'm getting married. I'm looking good. I have to wear a watch for this. And you chose the pole router. So let's turn it around to you. You have first hand experience here. Did you consider it more as a dress watch to pair with your attire? Or I'm wearing a sports watch to my wedding |
| Stephen Pulvirent | ? Yeah, I definitely thought of it as as a dress watch. And I mean I I have worn that watch on many straps over the years. I've worn it on NATOs. I've worn it on weird little beads of rice bracelets. Like I've I've basically any strap I own has probably been on that watch if it's the right size at some point. Um however, like I I found one of these, like, you know, I took one of the textured calf straps that that we sell in the shop uh in that sort of like light taupey gray color. Um, you know, I was wearing a white, white shirt, navy suit, sort of a like uh earthy colored uh grenadine tie. Uh, and it just it felt like it worked. It was the right colors, it was the right, the right feel. It was sort of dressy, but not too stuffy or dressed up. Um it was a vintage watch, but it wasn't what I had to worry about. Like I didn't have to worry that if I have like one too many glasses of champagne that I was gonna like ding it on something, you know, which uh was nice. Uh I I didn't have to sweat that out. But uh yeah, I I think one of the strengths of the pole router, I think, is how versatile it is. And I still to this day think like, you know, to your point, Cole, in the story, if you're a person looking to get into vintage watches and you want something that like has an entry level price point, but that five, 10, 20 years from now, you're not going to be like, oh, that was cute. You know, like you're still gonna love the watch. I I don't know. I don't think there's anything better than a pole router. I still think it's one of the best watches ever made. I'd uh I'd agree with you. Well, you know, let's let's maybe then end the discussion of the poll router there. I would say I would say if anybody hasn't seen Cole's video, read the review, go do that. It's linked up in the show notes. Um but Danny, I wanna I wanna transition over to a story you wrote uh that was actually back before the holidays uh in in December. And that was the story of how the Rolex Day Date became the de facto NBA starter watch. Can you tell us like where the idea for this story came about? It's like not an obvious thing |
| Ben Clymer | . Not at all. I think I was having a conversation with with Davey and something just came up and somebody asked, you know, what if there was like one watch that all NBA players wore and for some reason I'm a huge NBA junkie and I like live and breathe it and I just said it like it was obvious. I was like, it's the day date. And I had no actual factual basis. I just knew that and I needed to actually make sure that I was right about that. Um and luckily it's it's it is the case, but it's a watch that I've always seen on every player. And it could be, you know, the larger model or the classic 36 36mm size. Um, but it's a watch I've seen every uh everywhere from a rookie to LeBron to Michael Jordan. So when you're talking like that spread, I don't know who I mean my in my article I kind of get into, you know, maybe Michael Jordan had some level of influence on, you know, tastemaking for a lot of the players, but even if that's not necessarily the case, the watch, as we know, like speaks for itself. I mean it is it is that has that kind of gravitas to it. Um and so yeah, I mean this purely came from me just spewing a fact that I figured I knew was right and it it turned out that it was. And and it's it's just an an awesome thing to see because a lot of times with athletes you see a lot more, you know, hot horology, super diamond encrusted, you know, bling pieces. And this watch is like fairly conservative, and most of the time they wear it in its most conservative state. And I find that to be pretty interesting too. Um so that's where it that's where it where |
| Stephen Pulvirent | the idea kind of originated. The day date toes this really strange line where like it is instantly recognizable and it's also not obnoxious. You know, like in the same way that the pole router can be your first vintage watch for a thousand bucks and ten years later you're still gonna think it's amazing. Like if you're an NBA player, like you can buy a gold day date when you're a rookie or when you finish your first season and like wear it when you retire and no one's gonna be like, you couldn't you couldn't find something better, you know? Uh which I think is is a tough thing. Like very few watches and very few products in general have that kind of latitude and I think uh that the day date does and for good for good reason. |
| Ben Clymer | It's also one of the most, if not the most, recognizable watch. I mean, I think a little bit of the Royal Oak, because from the bracelet alone, you can spot it. Because there are, I think, rare examples of date just that have the presidential bracelet. I don't know if that's something that, you know, came stock original or those are special order, but for the most part, when you spot that, you're looking at a day date. Um it's always precious metal. So it's what a and the dial design is, you know, an icon in its own right. So it's like it's hitting all these levels, the entire watch, it's greater than the sum of its parts. And it's one of those things where you know from afar when you see it what it is. And that's why I think it was so buried in my brain. But what really opened up the story for me, because you mentioned I'm in Bethesda now and I've lived in the DC area my whole life, um I grew up unfortunately a Washington uh Wizards basketball fan, which is a really sad thing. So so sorry. That is the podcast. Are they not are they not around anymore? No, they are. They're just sort of like it's kinda like being a Knic |
| Stephen Pulvirent | ks fan. The fact that Cole was like, do they exist? Is is kind of the summary. Well, to put it in |
| Ben Clymer | context, the Harlem Globetrotters win every game that they play. Um and they always play the Washington Generals. Um so just like Washington basketball in general just doesn't have uh good connotation to it. Um we're like that classic we're cursed, you know, like we think we're cursed every year, even though we're not. It's just that we suck. Anyway, getting back to the story. About three years ago, um, John Wall, who used to be uh point guard for the Wizards, um, he was our franchise player, and around Christmas time, a story ran uh in the Washington Post and a few other places where he showed up to uh a team breakfast with fifteen uh Rolex boxes and just proceeded to hand them out to every single one of his teammates. And he bought every single teammate a president. He bought them all day dates for Christmas. And a lot of the players on our team at the time were like, you know, not even on guaranteed contracts. A lot of them were rookies or really young players. And not to say that NBA contracts aren't huge, you know, off the bat, um, but still they're not, you know, their financial future isn't secure. So they're not they're not going to be the types of people that are just gonna go spend all of their money because they're going sort of from contract to contract. It was a huge thing. A lot of them, it was their first watch. And it was the first time that I saw mainstream coverage of watches and sports kind of coincide. Um, and for the rest of that season, every time the players walked, you know, into the locker room, they do this sort of tunnel walk, and there's all these photos of the players, they're putting on their best clothes, kind of dressing in their best fits, their best sneakers, all that stuff. But every single one was wearing the day date that they got from John Wall throughout the whole season. And I think that's a team bonding thing. I think it goes to the heart of what watches mean, you know, as gifts when you get them from somebody, that they're much more meaningful when there's a story behind them. They're much more meaningful than just the gold they're made of, than just the price tag that's on them. Um it it really was something. You you see players wear different stuff all the time, but I will tell you from the unreasonable amount of attention I paid to the Washington Wizards that season that they all wore the the day date, um, that specific day date, and a lot of them still do. And I think that's just uh an incre incredible testament to that watch, to be honest with you, and just to watches in gener |
| Stephen Pulvirent | al that's incredible i i love that so much uh uh what one of the things that stood out from the story to me is is this quote you have from kevin love uh that i wanted to know if you could give us more context for. And that's then when asked about his uh why he wears a day date, he says it's a reminder that I don't have a Paul Newman. Uh, and I love that, and I think that could be interpreted a couple different ways. So I I kind of wonder how do So when I saw that, it was actually a |
| Ben Clymer | video and he says it in such a defeated fashion. He says he almost like lets out a sigh. It's almost like, it's a reminder I I don't have a Paul Newman Daytona. And he kind of just like puts the watch down and wants to move on with the conversation. And and you can tell it hurts. It's like painful for him. And it's like the pain of a real watch enthusiast that that kind of knows what he's doing, knows what he wants, and knows he doesn't have it. And that could be a s a situation of I'm sure he has access to Paul Newman Daytonas, you know, and he definitely has the means, but maybe there's a specific one he really wants. You know what I mean? Like there's there's only one and when that comes up he'll get it. Interestingly enough, literally I think either a day before the story ran or three days after the story ran, Kevin Love did an architectural digest tour of uh his New York apartment and what's on his wrist, a Paul Newman Daytona. What? Yeah. He's holding out on us, man. I know. Oh it so I figured that would be good to drop here. So if anyone wants to go check out that video, he's wearing it throughout the whole tour and you spot it when he gives uh when he goeses and giv a tour of his closet you can see it in full view. I don't think he had it in that original interview. I think this was a an acquisition that happened you know somewhere down the line. Because there was a good eighteen months between these two things, I would say. Did who does Kevin Love play for? Uh so he plays for another unfortunate franchise, the Cleveland Cavaliers. And he kinda got stranded in Cleveland, I'll put it that way. Did he have a good season? Is that why he bought the watch? Did the Cavaliers have a good season? He's been a well paid player, I'll put it that way. Okay, okay. Also, for all who don't know, Kevin Love is the nephew of Beach Boy Mike Love. And wait, what? Yeah. Mm-hmm. Danny's just coming in, just dropping mad trivia on us today. Yeah, so he's got some good Beach Boy connection. Mike Love, eh, in terms of like Beach Boys, probably my least favorite, maybe one of my least least favorite, you know, 60s era musicians, but also a daytona wearer, so there's a good little watch bridge between the two of them. Wow. Okay. Uh sorry, my wonder if you're listening |
| Stephen Pulvirent | . We gotta if he's listening, get him on the show. Kevin Love, if you're listening, come on the pod. Danny Danny will uh grill you about Paul Newman's and uh day dates. Oh yeah. Uh I w I wanted to know, have you spotted any good watches this NBA season? And this question is open to both of you, but I'm guessing Cole's not watching too much basketball based on the questions that have been asked. But uh I I haven't seen anything crazy yet. And I haven't watched a ton of basketball yet this year, but uh I wonder if you've seen anything anything good either courtside or or before or after games |
| Ben Clymer | . So I've noticed Draymond Green wears is known for wearing a white ceramic AP uh perpetual calendar, which is just a super cool watch. And that one sticks out like crazy. But then the the craziest one for me this season, you wrote about the AP, uh the black ceramic, the open work style. So LeBron was wearing that one. And what I love about that is I'm pretty sure LeBron at one point was an AP ambassador, but to my knowledge, no longer is. So he's a watch free agent. Um, but it just shows like A he's got the access to it, but B, it's just an awesome watch seeing him wear it. Um and so I think that it was like maybe a couple of days after your article dropped, I noticed that it blew up on Instagram that he was wearing that, which was pretty cool |
| Stephen Pulvirent | . But Brown wearing that watch. That's that's a lot of that's a lot of like winning in one place. Oh yeah. And there's a ton of I mean AP is pretty |
| Ben Clymer | standard in the NBA, but my favorite watch situation in the NBA right now is the Curry family. So you got Steph Curry, obviously. You got Seth Curry, who's his lesser-known brother, but still really good current NBA player. And their dad, uh Dell Curry, played in the NBA for like 10 or twelve years. So Steph, I think I mentioned him in the article, he wears a day date, but he also is known for almost always wearing a submariner. Just standard steel sub, which you never see. Like I would say of all watches to see on an NBA player, you would never see that. Um his dad wears the Batman and his brother wears the Batman on Jubilee. So that's just like a solid trio. They they know what they're doing. I'll put it that way. They know they know what they're doing |
| Stephen Pulvirent | . So that's pretty cool. That was cool for me. I gotta say it's not current, but my favorite NBA watch botting of all time is Michael Jordan wearing that Urwork courtside. Yes. Uh like uh I I just like anytime we're talking about basketball and watches, I know this is like not newsy, I'm not bringing anything new to the table here, but like as I was as we were, you know, prepping for this, uh I just kept coming back to that. And it's just like to see somebody that important and that like culturally keyed in wearing a watch like that is just like my my brain kind of melts every single time. And I I think, you know, you've already hit on the fact that there are many NBA players who are like really paying attention here and really into this. And I'm I'm optimistic that we're gonna continue to see more more and interesting watches, that these day dates are going to be jumping off points for people. Uh and that we'll continue to see great day dates. Like no no shade there at all. But uh like I'm I'm waiting for the first time, that like, you know, somebody rolls up wearing something really funky. Uh, and I'm I'm looking forward to it. W |
| Ben Clymer | ell, that's what I love about the NBA is unlike tennis or golf or a lot of the like single individual player sports where sponsorships are the name of the game. The NBA is pretty dominated by shoe deals and apparel deals. So you'll have like Adidas, Puma, Nike, obviously, like across the board, but you don't have as many watch deals. And so watch spotting is a lot more interesting in the NBA because these are personal choices. This is like the real stuff that they're interested in that they want to wear. Of course, there's some guys that have brand partnerships, but for the most part, it's organic stuff. And that's why I have a lot of fun checking those out and whenever I can marry my love of watches in the NBA it's a good day. So |
| Cole Pennington | also you mentioned the Wizards. Jordan played for the Wizards at one point, right? He he uh he did. He was also the general manager on uh during that time is where remember that data graph in depth story. Yeah I I I do I wrote that one. Include that. Yeah. Um datagraph |
| Ben Clymer | . Yeah, how big was the datagraph? Was it like thirty-eight mil |
| Stephen Pulvirent | limeters or something like that? I can't re the original data graph. I think the original's 39 and the new one's forty one, I believe. Still crazy for Michael Jordan to be rocking a 39 millimeter watch, I've got to say. I mean that would be like me wearing like a 28mm watch. You know, like that's that's no joke. Uh awesome. Well, thanks for doing this guys. This was super fun. Um I just really enjoyed both these stories and selfishly wanted to like sit down and chit-chat about them. So uh thanks for humoring me and yeah, lots of lots more to look forward to in 2021. Awesome. Thanks, Steven. Thank you, sir. All right. And to take us home this week, we've got actor, designer, and watchmaker Aldous Hodge talking about how horology can be used to build a legacy. |
| Aldis Hodge | Closing Thoughts by Aldous Hodge. My language is art, specifically the art of design, which I applied with an obsessive passion that eventually became purpose. I remember drawing my first watch when I was either 18 or 19 years old after I had just become a student at Art Center College of Design in Pasadena, California. It was a wooden wristwatch with a wooden cuff style strap. I'm not sure if the design was any good. That's not important though. What is important is the symbolism it carried. It wasn't until many years later that I was able to see the real value in that very distinct design. But I'll expound on that later. In my college classes, our primary focus was automotive and architectural work, but for some reason my mind drifted towards horological design, which they didn't teach, so I taught myself. I became enthralled by the intricacies of watch movements and how they were composed. In my mind, designing movements was kind of like developing a Tom Kundig house and building a 351 Cobra engine inside of it. It seemed to make no sense, yet at the same time made all the sense in the world. I've been enamored with the freedom that the imagination of conception afforded me ever since I was two years old. I knew three things at a very young age. One, tomorrow isn't promised. Two, life isn't a fair game, and three, you must do your best in order to recognize and appreciate the blessings laid before you. I come from a beautifully spirited family. My siblings and I were raised between New York City, New Jersey, and California by our gorgeous and courageous mother who wasn't always dealt a fair hand. She had a tremendously hard life, yet she always persevered, even in the darkest times, like when we were living in our car, she was always and still is a champion who instilled her never give up fighting spirit in me. I knew that I wanted for us to live a better life one day and for my mother to be afforded the comfort she deserved. I never thought that I would ever earn enough money to buy a nice house or a car. I thought that if I designed it myself, I could build it. Proper education, both scholastic and cultural, was the key. It was also my mother's highest priority for us. This is one of the primary reasons I began sketching blueprints for houses at the age of twelve. Mom took notice and put me into a mentorship program where I actually interned at an architecture firm between the ages of 13 and 15 years old. Little did I know how much that would influence my horological design aesthetic. She's also the reason I started college at 14, going through a few different institutions before landing at my favorite school, ACCD. This mentality of self-motivation came from the necessity to create an opportunity where there wasn't one. Which is why I tell kids all the time, you're not a product of your environment. Your environment is a product of you. My desire to create was further galvanized by my environment's lack of recognition of who I was. I grew up in a country that told me through subtle reinforcing factors that I wasn't supposed to amount to much in life. Oftentimes people who didn't look like me Scientist, doctor, engineer, or anything remotely associated with cerebrally motivated pursuits were never on their list, which was deeply insane Of my mother, I probably would have believed it. The most alarming environment was actually elementary school. I'd never saw myself reflected in the history books. Growing up, I loved inventors, and Leonardo da Vinci was one of my favorites. There were many accounts of his great feats. However, there weren't any for George Washington Carver, a black American inventor who created over 100 products derived from the peanut. Nor were there any acknowledgments of other black inventors whose designs greatly contributed to the ease of our daily lives, such as Garrett Morgan, The Traffic Light, nineteen twenty three, Marie Van Britten Brown, the Home Security Assistant nineteen sixty six, Alexander Miles, automatic elevator doors eighteen eighty seven, or Saraboon, an improved ironing board eighteen ninety two, and the list goes on and on. That list reaches into the watchmaking field as well, specifically to Benjamin Banneker, a self taught mathematician, astronomer, and horologist who is rarely mentioned in the horological world. Yet another black inventor excluded from the history books. Here's a genius of a man who built his own clock from scratch in 1753. He borrowed his neighbor's pocket watch, took it apart, and drew each piece. He then utilized those sketches to carve out a wooden clock using just a knife. What a painstaking challenge that must have been. And then to be able to calculate all of those ratios by his own determination, he was truly a savant. As a result, Banneker created the very first striking time device in America. It kept time and struck the hour for over fifty years until it was destroyed in a fire. It's astounding to me that the very first striking clock invented in North America was made by a black man. For a young black kid with engineering aspirations to know this and see that representation is so very impactful. The fact that it was a wooden clock run by wooden gears was a strange coincidence. His creation resonated with me personally because when I think back to my very first watch sketch, the all-wooden wristwatch, it let me know that my efforts in this profession are connected to something bigger than design, bigger than watchmaking, and bigger than myself. I'm connected to legacy. This is more than just trying to build a watch. This is about building legacy. That is the primary motive for establishing my horology brand, A Hodge Atelier? I hope that my brand will stand as a representation of all of the virtues that have been reaffirmed within me through my experience with horology. I wish to represent the strength of knowing one's true value, the power of perseverance and belief, and the necessity to educate oneself beyond what is placed in front of you. I aspire to develop educational horological programs for children and young adults not only to learn the mechanical and scientific aspects of what we do, but also to develop the mental fortitude that is needed to succeed. Those aspirations are actually the inspiration I chose as the foundation for my logo. You see, skeleton keys were theoretically devised to bypass any lock, and I would like my brand to stand as a reminder that you can use your mind to bypass any of the world's locks, no matter what the challenge may be. I would like people to learn from my journey, my mistakes, failures, flaws and all, and successes, and I want them to see that it's worth it to never give up on yourself, especially in the face of adversity and naysayers. Horology has exposed me to so much wonderful life beyond my original scope. I've met so many incredible people, traveled to amazing countries and learned about so many different cultures, so much history. I'm even learning a new language because of it. Most importantly, this journey has opened me up to a newfound purpose, and I wish to share what it has provided for me with many young people who are seeking that very thing. Well, there's so much more to say, but the rest of this story will be told through legacy. For now, I'll end with the words of Nelson Mandela for anyone currently navigating through difficulties on their path to purpose. I don't lose. I either win or learn. |